Transkrip diambil dari YouTube. Klik timestamp biru untuk melompat ke posisi tersebut di pemutar.
0:03 TV. Listeners, let's listen to our chat 0:11 with Bang Abdullah. Hehehaha. Peace be 0:14 upon you and Allah's mercy and 0:16 blessings. How are you, Bang Dula? 0:19 >> And peace be upon you too, Mas Ihsan. 0:22 Praise be to God, I am healthy. 0:24 >> We offer our condolences, Bang Dulah. I 0:27 just remembered that last Friday, at 0:29 this hour, you were still accompanied 0:32 by your beloved wife at the hospital. 0:35 But such is life. What would Bang Dula 0:38 like to share regarding the wisdom of 0:41 life as we begin our chat? But before 0:45 that, I also want to ask about this new 0:49 maneuver from a certain Luhut regarding 0:52 changing corruption to just bribery, 0:55 claiming it's from the United Nations, 0:58 but many are upset, while others like 1:01 Sahroni support it. It's him again, him 1:05 again, as the Betawi people say, just 1:07 like the MUI affair or the concert 1:09 yesterday. But they say the concert 1:11 tomorrow will be really cool. What does 1:14 Bang Dula see amidst this heated 1:16 temperature, with a hot issue regarding 1:19 corruption and also, perhaps, the 1:22 changing world? Maybe Bang Dula has his 1:26 own perspective on the demands for 1:29 Gibran's removal, whether it's possible 1:31 , and how the story of this 1:33 extraordinary republic will unfold. 1:37 Please, Bang Abdullah. Right, listeners 1:41 , for our gathering on this blessed 1:44 Friday morning. First, in Law Number 31 1:49 of 1999 in conjunction with Law Number 1:54 20 of 2001 concerning corruption 1:56 offenses, there are 30 articles 2:00 >> 30, sorry, not articles, but 30 2:02 corruption cases, 30 types of 2:04 corruption 2:06 >> which are simplified into seven major 2:08 families of corruption 2:11 >> the first is that which causes state 2:14 losses 2:15 >> the second is bribery. Hmm. 2:18 >> The third is embezzlement. 2:22 >> The fourth is extortion. 2:27 >> Then the sixth is fraudulent acts. The 2:32 seventh is conflict of interest. Then 2:37 the eighth is gratification. Hmm. 2:41 >> So those are the seven major families 2:43 of corruption. Now, if Luhut Panjaitan 2:50 says that what is called Article 2 and 2:54 Article 3 concerning state losses must 2:57 be removed 3:00 >> because of the ratification of the 3:03 UNCAC, which is a UN unit 3:08 >> actually, in the provisions of the 3:10 UNCAC that were ratified Hmm. 3:14 >> The KPK's authority is even expanded to 3:17 investigate corruption in the private 3:19 sector. Hmm. 3:21 >> All this time, the private sector has 3:23 not been in the KPK's domain, 3:26 >> but with the UN ratification, the KPK 3:28 can also enter the private sector. 3:32 >> That's it. So, with that, we can 3:36 understand that what Luhut Panjaitan 3:40 mentioned relates to his family and his 3:44 companies. Therefore, if he doesn't 3:50 take action, those private companies 3:52 could be hit if the KPK also has the 3:54 authority to conduct investigations 3:56 into the private sector. 3:59 >> So, that is one thing. The second thing 4:02 , 4:04 >> Article 2 is about state losses that 4:08 can bring profit to oneself, others, or 4:12 corporations. Now, then Article 3, 4:16 Article 2 paragraph 1, like that. 4:20 Article 2 paragraph 2 mentions that 4:22 under certain circumstances, the death 4:25 penalty can be applied. 4:27 >> Hmm. 4:28 >> Now, if we look at Surah Al-Ma'idah 4:31 verse 33 4:33 >> it is covered there. 4:35 >> So cases of murder, cases of theft, 4:37 cases of damaging 4:40 >> Oh 4:40 >> nature. Hm. 4:41 >> Well, damaging. So, for example, cases 4:45 of flooding in North Sumatra, 4:49 >> in Aceh, then in West Sumatra and other 4:52 places 4:54 >> based on article 2 paragraph 2, they 4:57 can be sentenced to death. Then 5:01 referring to Surah Al-Ma'idah verse 33. 5:05 Now, because of that, article 2 and 5:06 article 3 are to be removed because 5:08 they could face the threat of the death 5:10 penalty, or be crucified, or have their 5:12 limbs cut off. I saw that Luhut 5:17 Pandjaitan and several others are 5:20 included in the Panama Papers as having 5:22 shares in, you know, overseas, like 5:24 that. 5:27 >> About 100 Indonesians, including Luhut 5:30 Pandjaitan. Now, regarding article 3 5:34 concerning state losses in the exercise 5:37 of office, if we look at the case of 5:40 Umar ibn al-Khattab when he was caliph 5:46 >> he found out that his son, Abdullah bin 5:50 Umar, had his camels fed by state-owned 5:53 pastures and given water from 5:56 state-owned sources. When Umar found 6:00 out, Umar was angry and then ordered 6:02 them to be sold, 6:04 >> those camels, and then the initial 6:06 capital was given back to Abdullah bin 6:08 Umar. 6:09 >> The profits went to the Baitul Mal. 6:12 >> So, that is where article 3 has its 6:15 basis. If we, for example, refer to the 6:19 1945 Constitution, article 29 paragraph 6:21 2, then it is based on the provisions 6:24 that exist within each religion. So 6:29 based on Islam, what Umar did is 6:32 already contained in the 6:34 Anti-Corruption Law, article 3. 6:38 Therefore, 6:40 >> hm 6:41 >> if they want to remove article 2 and 6:44 article 3, it means violating article 6:46 29 paragraph 2 of the 1945 Constitution 6:49 . Now, then the second one is 6:54 >> bribery. 6:56 >> Now, bribery is 6:59 >> both active bribery and passive bribery 7:02 . Active bribery is when we go to a 7:05 public service office, whether it's the 7:07 vehicle registration office or anything 7:09 else, and we give an envelope first; 7:11 that is called active bribery. 7:13 >> Oh, even though it's not finished yet, 7:14 right? Correct. 7:16 >> A gift. 7:18 >> But for passive bribery, for example, 7:20 if I am elected regent, mayor, governor 7:23 , or president, I will give you a car, 7:25 that is passive bribery. So it is 7:28 already, in the Criminal Code, referred 7:30 to as a promise. Now, that promise is 7:33 included as corruption. Bribery, active 7:35 bribery, passive bribery. 7:37 >> Third, embezzlement. 7:39 >> Embezzlement. Embezzlement is 7:42 >> for example, Mas Ihsan is the treasurer 7:46 of a company. 7:48 >> Now, the money in the company is for 7:50 the company's interests or for the 7:53 benefit of many people. But Mas Ihsan, 7:56 without the permission of the 7:58 management, uses it himself, whether 8:00 it's a car, a motorcycle, or money; 8:02 that is embezzlement. It is called 8:04 embezzlement like that. Because it is 8:06 public goods but used for personal 8:09 interest. Hm. 8:11 >> So, cases of natural disasters, the MBG 8:14 case, and cases like, what do you call 8:17 it, the Red and White village 8:19 cooperatives, these involve elements of 8:21 embezzlement because they are communal 8:24 property used by individuals without 8:27 permission or knowledge. 8:30 >> Then the fourth is extortion. 8:33 >> There is active extortion and passive 8:36 extortion. Active extortion is, for 8:39 example, when we go to a public service 8:41 office and an employee demands one 8:43 million. So, that demand for one 8:46 million is active extortion. 8:50 >> If it's passive extortion, well, we've 8:53 been queuing from 7:00 until 12:00, 8:57 then someone comes late, gives money, 9:00 and we are made to wait longer; we are 9:04 forced into it. Especially if we are 9:09 working, or a child is sick, or 9:10 something; that’s what’s called 9:12 passive extortion; we are manipulated 9:14 so that we eventually have to follow 9:16 their terms. 9:18 >> Then, moving on. 9:22 >> Conflict of interest is, for instance, 9:24 what you might call the case of. 9:29 >> The Constitutional Court. 9:30 >> The Constitutional Court regarding. 9:32 >> Gibran's high school diploma. 9:34 >> And then. 9:36 >> Jokowi came in the afternoon, came at 9:38 night to visit Prabowo for several 9:40 hours. 9:41 >> During the reading of the 9:43 Constitutional Court's decision. That 9:46 is a conflict of interest; I mentioned 9:49 last Friday that in the Javanese power 9:52 system, if the people are unhappy with 9:54 a king's policy, they just come to the 9:57 town square and sit there. The King 10:01 already knows that this is a protest. 10:03 So, Jokowi just came and sat with 10:05 Prabowo, chatting away aimlessly. But 10:09 then, of course, reports were sent to 10:11 the people at the Constitutional Court 10:13 that Mr. Jokowi was at Prabowo's house, 10:15 so the decision should have been 10:16 disqualification. Then they just said 10:21 that, what’s it called, no evidence 10:24 was found regarding the high school 10:27 diploma issue. Now, that is a conflict 10:32 of interest. 10:34 >> After that, there is fraudulent conduct 10:35 . Hmm. 10:37 >> Fraudulent conduct is like the MBG case 10:39 , the cooperative case, and the 10:41 disaster cases; those are examples of 10:43 fraudulent conduct. 10:46 >> And finally, there is gratification. 10:49 When the Prophet Muhammad received 10:52 zakat collected by a companion, the 10:55 companion said, "This zakat belongs to 10:57 you, O Messenger of Allah, and this is 11:00 a gift for me from the zakat payers." 11:04 The Prophet was angry and immediately 11:06 announced it in a sermon at the mosque. 11:09 That person claimed he received gifts 11:11 from the zakat payers. If he lived at 11:14 his mother's or father's house, would. 11:17 >> The wealth or those gifts have come to 11:19 his house? Just like that. 11:22 >> Therefore, regarding gifts received as 11:24 an official, there is a very strict 11:27 hadith about it. Officials. 11:31 >> Who receive gifts are the same as 11:33 thieves. So, let's look at. 11:37 >> Ministers, Governors, Regents, Mayors, 11:39 members of the Regional People's 11:41 Representative Council who receive 11:43 gifts on their birthdays, according to 11:45 the Prophet, that is stealing. 11:47 >> Or let's say, receiving wedding gifts 11:49 for their child, that is called 11:51 stealing, just like how many of our 11:53 officials, from Aceh to Papua, steal 11:55 all the time because they accept such 11:58 gifts as officials. Well, that is 12:01 actually what is happening with the 12:03 proposal from the, uh, what is it, 12:05 Economic Council 12:07 >> economic 12:08 >> Indonesia yes, the National Economic 12:11 Council. Correct. And it's supported by 12:15 a DPR member named Syahroni. Him again, 12:18 it’s always him. 12:20 >> Yes. Because of their personal 12:22 interests like that, Mas. 12:24 >> But, Sir. 12:25 >> Now, then, yes. How is it, Mas? But are 12:28 there also officials who are, you know, 12:30 just simple, Bang? Who remain simple, 12:32 just getting by, but get caught in 12:35 corruption because they're desperate, 12:38 signed the wrong document, were set up 12:41 by other superiors, or something like 12:43 that? Does that happen, Bang? Uh, 12:45 trapped by the rules, perhaps. What do 12:47 you think, Bang? As mentioned by Anies 12:51 Baswedan, there is corruption by need, 12:55 corruption by greed, corruption by 12:58 opportunity, and corruption exposé. 13:02 >> Corruption by need is corruption driven 13:05 by necessity. 13:06 >> I think about 70%of civil servants 13:09 commit corruption because of necessity. 13:14 >> I was the deputy chairman of the State 13:14 Official Wealth Audit Commission for 13:14 four years. So I know very well that 13:18 the salaries of those civil servants 13:20 during the New Order era 13:22 >> up to the start of the reform era were 13:25 not just small, Mas Isan, they were 13:27 inhumane. 13:28 >> So, for an honest civil servant, in one 13:30 month they would practically die three 13:33 times, because their salary only lasted 13:35 for ten days. 13:37 >> How they survived for the next ten days 13:38 meant they had to do all sorts of 13:40 things. So that is because of necessity 13:42 , strictly because of necessity. Now, 13:44 the handling of this is different. 13:46 Secondly, corruption by greed. 13:49 >> I often mention that the Constitutional 13:50 Court chief 13:52 >> who was arrested by the KPK 15 years 13:54 ago, his salary was 100 million a month 13:57 , Mas Isan. 13:59 >> 100 million a month, yet he still 14:00 committed corruption. Now, that is what 14:02 is called corruption due to greed. 14:04 >> Then the third is corruption due to 14:07 opportunity. 14:09 >> They didn't intend to commit corruption 14:10 , but the opportunity arises every day. 14:12 It comes every day, it comes every day. 14:15 >> Especially if their family, wife, or 14:17 husband is also materialistic, they 14:19 eventually get involved. So, because of 14:23 that, within our legislative system, 14:28 >> once a law is passed by the DPR and the 14:30 president, the public is considered to 14:33 know, the society is presumed to know. 14:37 This is why the public needs to read 14:38 the laws and so on. Actually, if a 14:42 Muslim doesn't read the law, if they 14:44 follow the teachings of the Quran and 14:46 Sunnah, they also know that if 14:47 something isn't their right, they 14:49 shouldn't take it, and so on. But 14:52 because our problem is that religious 14:54 understanding, Islamic understanding is 14:57 very minimal, and then there's laziness 15:00 to read laws, especially laws that are 15:02 hundreds of pages long. That becomes a 15:06 problem. 15:06 >> So it is mentioned that there is*mens 15:09 rea*. 15:09 >> Now, *mens rea* 15:11 >> is intent. How can intent be known? 15:14 Intent can be seen from several actions 15:17 . For example, Mas Ihsan, if you're sad 15:19 , it shows on your face. 15:21 >> Or if you're happy, it also shows on 15:23 your face. It's like that. So, 15:25 therefore, in the study of corruption, 15:27 the 'mens rea' looks at whether they 15:29 received something or not. 15:32 >> Whether they got feedback or not. So 15:34 it's observed whether, oh, they indeed 15:37 had such an intention. 15:39 >> Now, this is what the public must 15:42 understand, and because of that, the 15:45 KPK always socializes this down to the 15:48 grassroots level, Mas I. I remember the 15:51 KPK even used things like stories, 15:55 >> fairy tales, or things like that. So, 15:58 as a result, in my 4 years of 16:01 experience at the KPK, 8 years at the 16:04 KPK, the majority of them actually did 16:07 it because they didn't know it was 16:10 forbidden by law. For example, 16:14 >> gifts, you know, usual gifts, what's it 16:17 called? 16:19 >> Birthdays. 16:22 >> Gifts, and various other things, are 16:24 considered a normal tradition. But then 16:27 , for example, in the law, it's 16:29 prohibited; for instance, like this, 16:32 Mas Ihsan. 16:33 >> Mas Ihsan is taking care of, what's it 16:35 called, a land deed (AJB). Now, an AJB 16:37 is usually handled at the sub-district 16:39 office, by the sub-district head. 16:42 >> So, if Mas I wants to go to the 16:44 sub-district office 16:46 >> in Cibubur, taking a car or public 16:48 transportation, and so on. Even though 16:50 the sub-district head lives in the same 16:52 neighborhood as Mas Ihsan. 16:53 >> Yes. 16:54 >> So Mas thinks, why should I go to the 16:56 office far away using some vehicle, 16:58 just come to the house, to the house of 17:00 Mr. 17:01 >> Sub-district head. Hmm. 17:04 >> And then Mas Ihsan thinks it's 17:06 uncivilized, impolite if he comes 17:08 without bringing gifts, right? 17:12 >> Bringing bananas, bringing what, 17:13 bringing durian, bringing anything, not 17:15 bringing anything is considered 17:16 disrespectful, like that. Then the 17:20 sub-district head also feels it's 17:23 uncivilized not to accept that gift. 17:27 >> Even though this is state business, 17:28 government affairs that must be 17:30 completed at the office and so on. Well 17:34 , that tradition is considered okay, 17:36 even though the law states that a state 17:39 official must not accept it. If they do 17:44 receive it, then they must report it to 17:45 the KPK within 30 working days. Oh, 17:47 return it. Is there a process where it 17:50 can be returned, brother? 17:52 >> Yes, it can be returned. For example, 17:54 when 17:54 >> I was still at the KPK, 17:57 >> the late [person] was in the hospital 17:59 for an operation, 18:01 >> uh, whatever that operation was, 18:04 >> a spinal surgery. 18:05 >> Hmm. That one. And then, various things 18:10 arrived, all sorts of things, I then 18:12 put them in the car, went straight to 18:15 the KPK, and reported it to the KPK. 18:20 >> Then they noted, "This one you can take 18:22 because it has nothing to do with your 18:24 position; this one you cannot take," 18:26 like that. So, because of that, when 18:30 the public knows about it, it doesn't 18:34 happen. Therefore, there were some DPR 18:37 speakers, MPR speakers, and who else 18:39 I've forgotten, when marrying off their 18:40 children 18:42 >> or getting married, they invited people 18:44 from the KPK to come. The KPK came to 18:46 be present there. Yeah. 18:48 >> Hmm. 18:49 >> I then record the items received, which 18:52 gifts are acceptable, which are not, 18:54 and so on. So, if someone has reported 18:58 it to the KPK and it has nothing to do 19:00 with their position or anything, it 19:02 must be returned within 30 working days 19:05 . 19:05 >> If after 30 working days they haven't 19:07 reported it, then it is considered a 19:09 bribe. And the most common cases 19:11 investigated by the KPK regarding 19:12 officials involve gratuities. Because 19:14 they, what's it called? Have reported 19:17 it, they have the political will to 19:19 report it to the KPK. It gets processed 19:22 . Ah, and then they get hit with that. 19:26 So, there are indeed people who don't 19:28 know, but the law stipulates that once 19:31 a law is passed, the people are 19:33 considered to know it. 19:36 >> That is what— 19:37 >> Yes, it is indeed difficult in our 19:39 country, Bang. People even say, "How 19:42 could Bang Dula's narrative be so nice? 19:44 But for us in the field regarding legal 19:47 matters or permits, if we don't provide 19:50 a lubricant, our business just grinds 19:53 to a halt." What do you think, Bang, 19:56 between these religious activists who 19:59 say—is this situation an emergency or 20:03 what, Bang? Yeah. 20:06 >> So, in one of the hadiths, 20:10 >> Yeah. 20:10 >> The Prophet said that a society is like 20:13 a beautiful garden. 20:15 >> Yeah. 20:15 >> Because of its scholars, its leaders, 20:18 >> its business people, its worshippers, 20:21 and the discipline of its people. 20:24 >> Conversely, said the Prophet, 20:26 >> that beautiful garden turns into a 20:27 wilderness full of wild beasts. If its 20:30 scholars are corrupt, its leaders are 20:32 unjust, 20:33 >> its merchants are dishonest, the 20:35 worshippers of Allah are showy, 20:37 >> and the people are undisciplined. The 20:39 people are undisciplined. So, because 20:42 of that, the people must be disciplined 20:44 . I remember, Mas Ihsan, when I was in 20:49 the first KPK term, the Minister of Law 20:52 from Makassar called me to ask me to 20:54 run as a KPK leader. I said, "No, I am 20:59 not a law graduate." At that time, I 21:01 didn't have a law degree yet. 21:02 >> I wasn't a law graduate, nor was I an 21:04 economics graduate. 21:06 >> Yeah. 21:06 >> The minister was surprised, "Sir, 21:08 you're not a law graduate? But when I 21:11 hear you speak, it sounds like you are. 21:13 " I told him I read from Islamic 21:16 history and the life of the Prophet. So 21:20 I follow the Prophet; I was driven to 21:22 do it because of following the Prophet, 21:24 not because I went to law school at the 21:27 time. So, therefore, in cases like the 21:32 one mentioned by Mas Ihsan, if the 21:35 companions, the ustadz, and the 21:38 teachers could follow Islamic teachings 21:41 , then they could avoid actions that 21:51 are already forbidden by the Quran and 21:54 the Prophet. But because we do not read 21:58 history and do not follow the Prophet, 22:01 we end up trapped in things that are 22:04 actually forbidden by Islam, which are 22:06 then incorporated into the laws we have 22:09 in our country. 22:12 >> Yes. Indeed, when a sense of shame is 22:14 gone, things become difficult in this 22:16 country. Look at this, Bang Dula, there 22:19 is a news headline about an open letter 22:21 from professors—not just law 22:23 graduates this time—regarding the 22:26 demand for the resignation 22:29 >> of Vice President Gibran, framed not as 22:32 a threat to the government. What do you 22:34 make of this, Bang? What is this? A 22:37 narrative from 150 professors sponsored 22:39 by Brawijaya University. Is it truly a 22:43 case of having no shame left, or how do 22:45 you see it, Bang Dulah? We are left 22:47 scratching our heads as people just 22:48 want to win at any cost, as long as 22:50 they are in power. And then they use 22:52 their power. How do you see it, Bang? 22:56 >> Two weeks ago, 22:58 >> Hmm. 22:59 >> there was a meeting of 70 national 23:02 figures in Bandung. Yeah. 23:04 >> And I was among those invited. 23:06 >> Heh. 23:07 >> Then, among the many recommendations, 23:09 one of them was requesting Gibran to 23:12 resign. 23:13 >> Hmm. 23:16 >> In one Hadith, it is stated that one of 23:19 the signs of a believer is a sense of 23:22 shame. Now, the problem is, does Gibran 23:25 have a sense of shame? Hmm. 23:28 >> His father was the Mayor of Solo for 10 23:30 years, Governor of Jakarta for half a 23:32 term, and President for 10 years with a 23:34 problematic diploma. 23:37 >> If he had a sense of shame, he would 23:39 have resigned or acknowledged such 23:41 things. So, as the Malay proverb says, 23:45 the apple does not fall far from the 23:48 tree. So, how could Gibran resign when 23:51 his father spent 20 years acting like 23:54 that? Therefore, I say it must be, what 23:58 you call it, a demand from the public. 24:01 But the problem is, which public? 24:04 People come, even clerics kiss Jokowi's 24:08 hand and then 24:13 >> meet with Prabowo. Prabowo promises to 24:17 build a new building and it’s over, 24:18 so this is the problem the Hadith 24:20 mentioned regarding the bad ulama; that 24:21 is the issue. 24:24 >> So, I think the cases of '67 and '97 24:27 were truly about the people. These 150 24:31 professors, because they are professors 24:34 , their approach is academic. They 24:37 cannot possibly stage protests like 24:38 students and so on. Yeah. 24:40 >> But it is good for them to encourage 24:43 students and the public, like, let's 24:46 say, the Ahok case, where every day, 24:49 right? 24:50 >> every day coming to 24:54 >> that led to Ahok going to prison, or 24:56 the '97 case, every day, every day, 24:59 every day. Like that. And so then, 25:03 >> the House of Representatives (DPR) is 25:05 also implicated, although in my opinion 25:08 , the DPR is quite difficult because, 25:10 for example, the Speaker of the House's 25:13 husband was involved in the Kominfo 25:15 case. Yes, like that. So they cannot 25:18 act; the PDI-P is also involved, and 25:20 Megawati is also being held hostage by 25:22 Jokowi and so on, like that. So, the 25:26 key, Mas Issan, is in the President's 25:28 hands; if Prabowo is serious, 25:31 >> Prabowo has the largest coalition, and 25:33 it would be settled like that. But if 25:36 Prabowo also feels 25:39 >> what do you call it, held hostage by 25:41 Jokowi, then also... 25:44 >> It means it has to be every day, let's 25:47 say 30 days, every single day, not just 25:50 at Monas, but the DPR must be occupied, 25:53 the DPR. And indeed, yes. 25:56 >> I'm sorry, I often say that there must 25:58 be sacrifices, there must be sacrifices 26:00 . If there are no sacrifices, it really 26:02 can't be done like that. We remember 26:05 back then, Harmoko, those empty days or 26:07 what not. But when students already 26:11 occupied Senayan like that, then the 26:14 MPR leadership members wrote a letter 26:17 to Suharto to step down. And Suharto 26:21 had a sense of shame. Well, like that. 26:23 Why? Because he was a fighter, 26:25 >> he was a fighter general. So, a denier 26:29 like 26:30 >> Gus Dur, because he was a fighter, he 26:34 resigned. Soekarno was also a fighter, 26:37 and then later. Now, as for Jokowi, he 26:41 isn't a fighter or anything, so how can 26:44 his child be like that? So, it must be 26:48 demanded by the public, Mas Is. Lastly, 26:52 Bang. This is a matter of, uh, what is 26:55 it? 26:56 >> Motivation for corruption. Yes, I once 26:58 knew a person, an activist, my old 27:00 friend Amir Husein Daulai, walking with 27:02 his wife in Pondok Indah. She said, " 27:05 Bang, when will we have a house like 27:07 this?""Yeah, after that, he was scolded 27:09 by his wife. This kind of wife is what 27:11 makes people become corruptors, right? 27:14 I also know your brother Fikria, his 27:17 wife is so simple. And I also know Bang 27:20 Abdullah's wife who is so simple. What 27:24 is the influence of a life partner on 27:26 corruption and our lifestyle? Maybe 27:30 Bang Dula can reflect on the journey of 27:31 life that has been lived. Please, Bang 27:34 Dula. 27:36 >> Yes. So, when I give technical guidance 27:40 to members of the Provincial, Regency, 27:42 or City DPRD, or to ministries. I 27:46 always share a snippet of my wife's 27:49 experience. 27:50 >> Hm. 27:52 >> First, if my wife wants to buy 27:54 something, wants something, she checks 27:56 the price at the store or wherever. 27:59 >> Only then does she save money until 28:02 it's enough, then she buys it. Like 28:04 that. So, no credit. Including my car, 28:08 it was also bought in cash, like that. 28:12 >> Now, the second habit of my wife is 28:14 that every time she shops for anything, 28:16 she hands over the receipt, hands over 28:18 the list 28:20 >> of those expenses to me, like that. Mas 28:23 Isa or the listeners might not believe 28:26 that the watch I bought in Malaysia 28:29 decades ago 28:31 >> is included in the LHKPN wealth report. 28:35 >> There is the receipt from decades ago, 28:38 so my wife is very orderly in that 28:41 regard. 28:43 >> So, one time she bought a second-hand 28:44 motorcycle from her brother-in-law in 28:46 East Jakarta, meaning if she wants to 28:48 go shopping nearby, she just rides the 28:50 motorcycle, no need for me to take the 28:52 car, it's jammed, just take the 28:53 motorcycle, like that. 28:56 >> Then at night she handed over the list, 28:58 I saw 75,000, I said 75,000 for what? 29:01 Oh, that was the fee for moving from 29:04 Jakarta to Depok, the transfer fee was 29:07 75,000 Rupiah. I asked," Where is the 29:09 receipt? "" Ah, they forgot because 29:11 they didn't give a receipt earlier. "I 29:13 said," Go back tomorrow and ask for "" 29:15 >> the receipt. "Masha Allah. 29:16 >> She went there to ask for the receipt. 29:18 Then the person said," Oh, there is no 29:20 receipt, Ma'am. "My wife said," I 29:22 brought a receipt book. "So my wife 29:25 brought a receipt book for them to sign 29:29 . The officer said," Oh, in that case, 29:32 wait, the person in charge is out. "" 29:34 Wait. "" 29:35 >> Then what if I wait? "said my wife. 29:38 >> While waiting, the officer asked," 29:40 Which NGO are you active in, Ma'am? " 29:42 She replied," I'm not in an NGO. "" I 29:45 am a housewife. "" Huh. " 29:46 >> More or less 5 to 10 minutes like that. 29:49 A person came out of the room and 29:50 handed over an envelope." Here, Ma'am, 29:52 the 75,000 Rupiah from yesterday is 29:54 being returned. " 29:55 >> So I always use that illustration to 29:59 show that civil servants or officials 30:02 also observe things before acting. 30:06 >> Oh. 30:06 >> They gauge the customer. Does this 30:09 customer have principles? Do they have 30:11 a firm stance like that? For example, 30:14 if you get a traffic ticket, they also 30:16 see if you're the type to bribe or not. 30:20 So therefore, 30:23 >> it is true what the Messenger said, 30:25 that besides scholars, leaders, 30:27 merchants, and the general public, the 30:30 last thing is societal discipline. So 30:33 if the public has that kind of attitude 30:35 , they also calculate before doing 30:37 anything," Am I like that too? "Well, 30:40 >> so it returns to each person, each 30:42 family, on how to apply Islamic 30:44 teachings to oneself. Start with 30:47 oneself, then the family, then, then 30:51 neighbors, then the neighborhood level, 30:55 up to the national level, which is 30:58 called Indonesia 2045 blessing, it's 31:02 like that. 31:03 >> Wow, thank you, Bang Dulah. Maybe a 31:05 closing statement or a reminder from 31:07 this blessed Friday. From a senior 31:11 citizen, Bang Abdullah Hehamahua. Even 31:14 though he is senior, we still call him" 31:15 Bang "because his soul remains young. 31:17 >> Please, Bang Dulah. What is your 31:19 closing statement, Bang? 31:21 >> So, people die, Mas Ihsan, not because 31:24 of illness. 31:27 >> If people died because of illness, then 31:29 doctors would never die, nurses would 31:32 never die. 31:33 >> But people die because their time has 31:36 come. Mathematically, I am 7 years 31:40 older than my wife. I should go before 31:44 her. 31:45 >> But in Islam, it is not a queue number, 31:48 but a lottery number. 31:50 >> If it were a queue number, I would go 31:51 first 31:51 >> before her. 31:53 >> But it is a lottery number, as Allah 31:55 has decreed. At 71 years old, it was 31:57 finished. As for me, only Allah knows 31:59 how long I have. Now, therefore, we 32:03 only strive to follow the Sunnah of the 32:06 Prophet, medical guidelines, and so on. 32:10 But after that," fa-idza 'azamta 32:12 fatawakkal' ala Allah, "then resolve 32:14 and surrender to Allah. Allah is the 32:17 one who determines everything. If we 32:19 look at it from the perspective of 32:22 effort, he got sick on Monday, went to 32:25 the hospital on Thursday night, and 32:28 passed away on Friday afternoon. It was 32:32 just that very short. So, with that, it 32:36 means we are only obligated to put in 32:38 the effort. After putting in the effort 32:40 , leave it to Allah. Then Allah is the 32:43 one who decides. Now, for the viewers, 32:46 regarding your family and workplace, do 32:49 what you can, but ensure it doesn't 32:51 conflict with the Quran and Sunnah, nor 32:54 with regulations that align with the 32:56 Quran and Sunnah; then leave it to 32:59 Allah, and He will decide. And 33:02 furthermore, we must be sincere in 33:04 living our lives and sincere in doing 33:06 everything. Because in the end, Allah 33:10 provides the best decision. That's 33:13 about it, Mas. 33:14 >> Thank you, Bang Dulah. May Allah grant 33:16 you patience, blessings, and health, 33:18 because the community still needs Bang 33:20 Dula's voice. Thank you, Bang. 33:23 Walaikumussalam warahmatullahi 33:24 wabarakatuh. 
