Transkrip diambil dari YouTube. Klik timestamp biru untuk melompat ke posisi tersebut di pemutar.
0:03 TV. Brothers and sisters, listeners of 0:09 Radio Silaturahim, may you be blessed 0:11 by Allah Subhanahu wa Ta'ala. We now 0:14 enter the Rasil news topic dialogue 0:16 space, observing various national 0:19 issues with a clear mind and, of course 0:22 , an open heart. Brothers and sisters, 0:25 today, Wednesday, October 28, 2026, we 0:28 commemorate Youth Pledge Day, a 0:31 historic momentum that reminds us of 0:34 the spirit of unity, struggle, and the 0:37 ideals of Indonesia. However, amidst 0:40 this commemoration, news has emerged 0:42 regarding planned demonstrations by 0:44 students and various social elements in 0:46 Jakarta. Various national issues, 0:49 ranging from the economy, education, 0:51 and law enforcement to the environment, 0:53 have become matters of public concern. 0:56 The question then is, are the students 0:57 'voices today a reflection of the 0:59 younger generation's anxiety regarding 1:00 the direction of the nation's journey? 1:03 Furthermore, how should the government 1:05 respond to the public's criticisms and 1:07 aspirations? And no less important, is 1:10 the spirit of the Youth Pledge still 1:12 truly alive in our policies and state 1:14 practices? To discuss this, we are 1:17 connected with Bang Toni Rosyid, a 1:20 national observer. Peace be upon you, 1:22 and Allah's mercy and blessings, Bang 1:23 Toni. 1:24 >> And upon you be peace, and Allah's 1:25 mercy and blessings. 1:26 >> How are you, Bang Toni? Are you doing 1:28 well, Bang Toni? Yes, 1:29 >> praise be to God, I am in good health. 1:32 >> Masyaallah, Bang Toni, today we are 1:34 commemorating the Youth Pledge, but at 1:36 the same time, news of planned student 1:39 demonstrations has surfaced. According 1:43 to you as a national observer, is this 1:45 merely a coincidence of momentum, or is 1:47 there indeed a political and social 1:49 message that the government needs to 1:51 read? Please, go ahead, Bang Toni. 1:55 >> Yes. The date of the 28th of October 2:00 commemorates Youth Pledge Day and 2:05 always becomes a momentum, especially 2:09 for young people. 2:13 >> Yeah. 2:14 >> And specifically for the students to 2:18 then conduct an evaluation of the 2:21 nation's journey. In this context, the 2:26 two-year journey of Mr. Prabowo 2:28 Subianto as the commander in managing 2:32 this nation. In my opinion, this ritual 2:38 and routine indeed need to be 2:41 maintained, nurtured, and continuously 2:44 preserved so that it becomes a moment 2:48 to conduct a principled evaluation. 2:54 That no government is perfect. 2:58 >> Yes. 3:00 >> Therefore, evaluation is needed, 3:03 criticism is necessary; yes, everything 3:06 in the nature of input is awaited. 3:11 Because of that, the government must 3:14 always be open to every criticism, 3:17 every input for evaluation. It must not 3:20 shut itself off. What is the problem? 3:25 Because every person or every group 3:27 finds it somewhat difficult to conduct 3:30 self-evaluation. They need others. A 3:34 healthy organization, community, or 3:37 gathering is one that always hires or 3:40 provides space for others who are 3:42 outside the system to conduct an 3:45 evaluation. Why? Because it is more 3:48 objective. Because it is more 3:51 comprehensive, because it is more 3:54 detailed, as they are not emotionally 3:56 tied, among other things, to the 3:58 internal system. Now, these students, 4:01 especially the young people, 4:03 >> their thinking is still clear. 4:06 >> Yes, youth organizations like HMI, PMII 4:10 , GMNI, Ansor, and also PII should 4:13 participate in providing an evaluation 4:16 of Mr. Prabowo’s leadership. This 4:21 shows a sense of love for this nation, 4:25 love for this country, and their love 4:29 for their leader, so that the leader 4:33 stays safe, stays on track, and can 4:36 create policies and programs that align 4:40 with the people's hopes. And this 4:44 serves as a bridge for the public’s 4:46 voice in general. These youths have 4:49 souls that are still clean and clear, 4:53 allowing them to convey the true 4:56 expectations, hopes, and aspirations of 4:59 the public. They are intellectuals. 5:02 They understand; even as young people, 5:05 they know what is right and what is not 5:07 . They understand what is straight and 5:09 what is crooked, they understand what 5:11 must be done and what must be left 5:13 behind. This is a momentum that must 5:17 continue to be nurtured, guarded, and 5:20 preserved, becoming increasingly 5:23 critical, substantive, and capable of 5:26 providing something more significant 5:28 and fundamental to this nation. So, we 5:34 support the youth 1000%, we support the 5:38 students 1000%in encouraging, pushing, 5:42 and providing input on Mr. Prabowo’s 5:46 leadership journey over these past two 5:50 years. And we truly hope that Mr. 5:53 Prabowo and the current government will 5:56 open themselves up and listen. Do not 6:00 be apathetic toward the youth. Treat 6:05 them as our children who are still 6:07 innocent, clear-headed, and have great 6:10 aspirations, possessing extraordinary 6:13 optimism, hoping that their parents 6:15 will guide them on the right path. That 6:20 is about it, Mas. 6:21 >> Alright, Bang Toni. As someone who has 6:24 experienced life as a university 6:27 student, right? What is the most 6:29 fundamental difference between the 6:31 student movements of the past and today 6:32 ? Then, in your own opinion, Bang Toni, 6:35 how can we distinguish between student 6:38 movements born from the people's 6:39 anxieties and movements ridden by 6:41 political interests? 6:43 >> Yes, like this, Mas. These are some 6:47 analogies we can use as a picture of 6:49 the differences between the past and 6:52 the present. Although there are also 6:55 many similarities. This is, if our 6:57 question is about the differences. Yes. 7:00 >> Back in our day, during the '98 7:02 generation, we were already about to 7:04 graduate, finishing college, right, 7:06 Bang. 7:08 >> During the reform era, what we faced 7:10 was Mr. Harto, who had been in power 7:12 for dozens of years. So it was clear 7:18 what the community was, and it was a 7:22 technocrat, a force. 7:26 >> A force that 7:28 >> hardly ever changed, it was stable. 7:31 >> Yes. What changed is minor; back then, 7:34 Mr. Harto was supported by the military 7:36 , then there was trouble with the 7:38 military, specifically the Army, and he 7:40 later leaned toward Islamic groups, 7:42 particularly moderate and centrist 7:44 Islamic groups, urban ones, with the 7:46 birth of ICMI. The difference is that 7:49 others were stable from year '66 to '97 7:51 /'98. 7:54 >> Yeah. 7:55 >> So, their policies were clear and 7:57 readable, and the supporters and those 7:59 inside were also clear. That's right. 8:04 Meanwhile, now it's multi-party; back 8:07 then there were only three parties, PPP 8:10 , Golkar, and PDI, who were 8:12 half-hearted because they lacked the 8:14 freedom to act as a check on the 8:17 government. The strongest one was 8:21 Golkar. So it's clear that now it's 8:25 multi-party; multi-party means today 8:29 it's A, tomorrow it's B. For example, 8:32 there is a survey I heard on the media 8:35 this morning, and Mr. Prabowo's rating 8:39 in that survey in general was 4.6. 8:44 >> Hm. 8:45 >> Among intellectuals, it was 2.8. But 8:49 those parties have already pledged 8:51 their support to nominate Mr. Prabowo 8:53 for 2029. 8:54 >> Yeah. 8:56 >> This is unique, strange. And funny, you 9:00 know. This is what students are facing 9:03 now. With so many parties, so many mass 9:10 organizations, and others, they are all 9:15 maneuvering. That maneuvering also 9:21 targets the youth and the students. 9:24 What is the result? Now there's Student 9:26 Council 1, 2, and 3 in one campus. 9:30 Divided; this council allies there, 9:33 that council allies here, and they 9:35 confront each other and so on. This is 9:39 what students are facing now. Although 9:41 we can still tell who's compromised and 9:44 who isn't. Back in our time, students 9:48 were relatively united, one voice, 9:50 although there were always a few 9:52 exceptions. But now they create rival 9:55 communities that are almost equal in 9:57 size. 9:58 >> Yeah. 9:59 >> So, this is a challenge for students 10:00 who still have a clear head. 10:02 >> Yeah. 10:02 >> Yes. Likewise, the temptations for 10:05 students today are much greater. Back 10:09 then, our biggest temptation was 10:10 pressure, 10:11 >> threats, intimidation, right? 10:14 >> There was relatively no temptation of 10:16 money. Even getting kidnapped. 10:17 >> But for students now, the temptation of 10:20 money is quite huge. 10:21 >> Yeah. 10:22 >> That's the thing. Back then, some 10:24 students became intelligence informants 10:26 , but only individuals. So, 10:28 intelligence among students has existed 10:30 for a long time. 10:31 >> Hm. 10:32 >> That's it. Not just now. But back then 10:35 it was a bit quieter. Only specific 10:37 individuals. 10:38 >> Now it's formed into an organization. 10:43 And the budget for it is also insane. 10:46 It's not just during Mr. Prabowo's time 10:48 ; it was already happening in the 10:50 previous era. 10:50 >> Yeah. 10:51 >> So back then, if we traveled to Jakarta 10:53 —I happened to study my undergraduate 10:55 degree in Semarang, then my master's 10:57 and doctorate in Jakarta. So when we 11:01 were in Semarang, if we traveled to 11:04 Jakarta, sometimes we'd take a truck or 11:07 a regular bus. Nowadays, it's rare to 11:12 find students—even from Surabaya, 11:15 Semarang, or Malang to Jakarta—taking 11:17 the bus; on average, they fly. 11:20 >> Yes. So, the welfare level of students 11:24 now is better than it was for us back 11:26 then, so generally, the militancy of 11:29 the '98 generation was stronger, and 11:31 the '66 generation was even stronger. 11:36 So along with that, this is what 11:38 creates, well, a slight difference, but 11:41 it doesn't mean— 11:44 >> fundamentally, there are still many 11:46 students now who possess extraordinary 11:48 persistence and refuse to be bribed, 11:50 even when money is thrown around. If we 11:54 know of a student who was suddenly 11:56 broke and then suddenly driving a 11:57 Fortuner, well, those are just bad 11:59 apples. 12:00 >> Yes. 12:01 >> Yeah. 12:02 >> Yes. I mean, we could only afford to 12:05 drive a Fortuner after finishing our 12:06 PhD, something like that. After 12:11 finishing a PhD, teaching everywhere, 12:13 working everywhere, and building 12:14 businesses everywhere. There are some 12:18 students now, well, they are just 12:20 anomalies, still students but driving 12:22 Fortuners, still students flying back 12:25 and forth, and so on. But, youth— 12:29 students—are the hope for this nation 12:33 . There are many young people, and 12:37 their numbers are far greater. Those 12:40 who have idealism, those who have 12:43 courage, those who are still objective, 12:46 those who dedicate their knowledge and 12:48 activities for the future of the nation 12:51 and state. And not a few students have 12:55 been arrested and then imprisoned. Not 12:57 a few students have also faced 12:58 intimidation. It is these types of 13:03 students that we can hope will 13:05 consistently and steadfastly continue 13:08 to warn the government, to keep the 13:11 government’s performance and policies 13:14 in check, regardless of who is in power 13:17 , especially now when these oversight 13:23 institutions have become weak and lost 13:26 their power and energy to perform their 13:29 duties. 13:31 >> Yes. Alright. However, on the other 13:34 hand, brother, we perhaps cannot simply 13:36 blame President Prabowo either. Because 13:38 we need to look at this nation's 13:40 problems as a whole. Because the 13:43 conditions faced today are certainly 13:45 inseparable from the policies and 13:46 issues inherited from the previous 13:48 administration. Moreover, this Prabowo 13:51 administration has only been running 13:52 for about two years. Certainly, there 13:54 is a process that requires time to make 13:56 improvements. The question is, how do 13:59 we, brother, place criticism 14:01 proportionally? We need to give space 14:04 for the government to work and make 14:06 improvements. But at the same time, the 14:08 government must also be open to 14:10 criticism and evaluation from the 14:12 public. 14:13 >> Yes. So, uh, in Mas Agus's words, that 14:16 we shouldn't, uh, what's it called, uh, 14:20 arbitrarily cast blame, right. But Mas 14:24 Agus also shouldn't be the government's 14:25 spokesperson, okay. Right. So, uh, 14:29 objective is the keyword. 14:32 >> Objective. 14:33 >> Right. Objectivity is the keyword. 14:36 >> Right. So, whoever the government is, 14:39 it doesn't matter. 14:40 >> Uh-huh. 14:41 >> When they are wrong, they must be 14:43 reminded. When they are mistaken, they 14:44 must be criticized. When they go off 14:47 track, right, they must be straightened 14:49 out. 14:49 >> Uh-huh. Whoever it is. That's the point 14:52 . That's why I am a person who is not 14:56 busy with the past, although it is a 14:58 record, I am not busy with people who 15:01 are not this. The current government is 15:04 Pak Prabowo's. The fate of the nation 15:06 in the future is in Pak Prabowo's hands 15:08 . So we don't need to stray anywhere. 15:12 Whether SBY to Megawati is the past, or 15:14 Jokowi is the past. Currently, the 15:18 blueprint for this nation going forward 15:20 is in Pak Prabowo's hands. If Pak 15:23 Prabowo coughs, it affects this nation. 15:25 If Pak Prabowo is sick, it affects this 15:27 nation. If Pak Prabowo has a cold, it 15:29 affects this nation. Right. If Pak 15:31 Prabowo is healthy, it affects this 15:32 nation. Therefore, for all policies, we 15:36 need to trace what Pak Prabowo's 15:38 mindset is. I am interested in what was 15:44 expressed by one of the, uh, survey 15:46 institute owners. There is a serious 15:50 issue within Pak Prabowo himself. 15:51 Between the paradigm, uh, 15:54 >> right, and the implementation in the 15:56 field, it is far different. For example 16:00 , from before I always said I support 16:03 the MBG program. MBG is, 16:07 paradigmatically, good and it is 16:09 Pancasila. You know. Providing 16:14 something to the community. But the 16:16 implementation, the human resources are 16:19 people who are not capable, not in 16:21 their, uh, field, do not have the 16:23 competence, the HR does not have 16:24 integrity. What is the proof? Well, 16:27 they keep changing, and then they get 16:29 caught by the KPK, you know. 16:32 >> That is real proof, right, caught by 16:34 the prosecutor's office, that is real 16:35 proof. And then, the planning isn't 16:39 mature. The management is messy; 16:44 paradigmatically, MBG is good. Likewise 16:50 with Food Estates, paradigmatically 16:53 it's good, but if then, uh, there's a 16:56 budget taken from the village, for 16:58 instance 100 million for 6 years, the 17:01 village can't build, money doesn't 17:03 circulate in the village, then it's 17:06 built, uh, by one, uh, what is it 17:09 called? Uh, there's a development 17:13 problem, then built on the edge of a 17:15 cemetery, uh, then in the middle of the 17:18 road, cramped against one another in 17:20 the middle of a rice field and so on, 17:22 right, and then now the roads are also 17:25 still struggling, it's not clear, give 17:27 it time. Yes, but we can measure it, 17:32 Mas Agus. 17:33 >> Uh-huh. 17:34 >> Exactly. If he does something like this 17:38 for so many years, what is the result? 17:41 It can be measured, right? There are 17:45 parameters to measure it, you know. So, 17:49 if there isn't a fundamental change, 17:52 this will head toward failure. Give him 17:56 a chance? Yes, we give him a chance. 17:58 >> Uh-huh. 18:00 >> But also, as we the people give him a 18:03 chance, we give input; don't just let 18:05 it be. We give criticism. 18:09 >> We are giving a warning. If we provide 18:13 a warning, it’s not out of 18:14 subjectivity; it is our objectivity as 18:16 children of this nation. Because of our 18:19 love for this country and nation, we 18:20 want this nation and country to be 18:22 better going forward. 18:24 >> Yeah. 18:25 >> Yes, that is objectivity. We can 18:28 distinguish between what is objective 18:30 and what is not. There are those groups 18:32 . If their voices turn into a political 18:33 party, then that’s already not 18:35 objective. That is 18:36 >> a bit difficult, you know. 18:38 >> Then furthermore, where is this person 18:40 affiliated? Affilia-uh, where is their 18:42 affiliation? Ah, when the affiliation 18:45 is here, then we look at the content of 18:46 their criticism. 18:48 >> Yes. 18:49 >> If then we, and that has become, uh, 18:52 what do you call it? The case of the 18:55 reform era. Right, if someone 18:58 criticizes, they say, "Ah, they just 19:00 want this.""Oh, that’s just political 19:03 ," you know. That’s a cliché, 19:05 that’s classic. Even though it keeps 19:10 happening, it shouldn't. Then if 19:13 students criticize, youth criticize, or 19:15 civil organizations criticize, we 19:17 shouldn't just consider it political. 19:20 That's not allowed. Yes, 19:22 >> that's the point. Any government or any 19:24 official must open their ears, minds, 19:27 and hearts to be able to accept what is 19:30 said by, well, uh, what's it called, uh 19:32 , uh, Ibn Mas'ud, for example. Now, 19:36 this is important to become our 19:38 objectivity. Ibn Mas'ud said that, 19:40 right? 19:41 >> Yes. So, Islam is a truth that exists 19:44 everywhere. If you find truth in 19:48 someone's words, even if you hate that 19:50 person, acknowledge it. Ali bin Abi 19:54 Talib also said the same thing, you 19:56 know. 19:56 >> Yeah. So if, uh, what's it called, you 20:00 find a truth, then look at what, uh, 20:03 what the content of that truth is. 20:07 Don't look at who is speaking that 20:09 truth. So objectivity is not only for 20:14 those who provide criticism to the 20:16 government, but objectivity must also 20:19 exist within the government itself. 20:23 Within the authorities themselves. If 20:25 the authorities are not objective, then 20:27 all input is considered garbage. 20:30 >> Yeah. 20:31 >> Yes, not open. Democracy is, well, an 20:35 objectivity that comes from all parties 20:38 . Because every human being has rights. 20:41 Everybody, uh, has rights, right? 20:45 >> Yeah. 20:46 >> Every person has rights, 20:48 >> yes, to speak and so on, or to organize 20:51 and so on. Every person has rights. 20:53 What does that mean? When we realize 20:56 those rights, then the government 20:58 becomes objective, yes. Then the 21:01 critics also become objective. 21:03 >> Yeah. 21:05 >> If that works, then democracy runs well 21:07 . If democracy runs, then the 21:09 government will work in accordance with 21:11 the public's expectations, the people's 21:14 expectations, 21:15 >> not in accordance with its own 21:17 expectations. 21:19 >> That's it, Mas Agus. 21:20 >> Very well. Now, Bang Toni, aside from 21:23 the dynamics of the student protests we 21:25 discussed earlier, there is another 21:27 issue that is also interesting, Bang. 21:29 Over the past few days, Minister of 21:31 Energy and Mineral Resources Lilah 21:32 Hadalia announced a policy to reduce 21:34 Indonesia's gas supply to Singapore. 21:37 Starting October 24, 2026, Indonesia is 21:40 reducing its piped gas supply by 31 21:42 million standard cubic feet per day. 21:47 The government stated that a portion of 21:49 that supply is being diverted to meet 21:51 domestic electricity and industrial 21:52 needs. Now, Bang Toni, if we look at 21:55 this policy, there are certainly two 21:57 sides that need to be examined. On one 22:00 hand, the government is obligated to 22:02 prioritize national interests and 22:03 ensure the people's energy needs are 22:05 met. But on the other hand, Indonesia 22:08 also has economic relations and trade 22:10 agreements with neighboring countries. 22:13 The question is: Is this government 22:15 move to reduce gas supply to Singapore 22:18 proof of courage in fighting for 22:20 national interests, or are there other 22:22 aspects we need to watch so this policy 22:25 doesn't actually create new problems in 22:27 Indonesia's future economic and 22:29 diplomatic relations, Bang? 22:33 >> Yes. In bilateral and multilateral 22:37 relations, Indonesia must always appear 22:40 as a nation that is comfortable for 22:43 other nations within a framework of 22:45 mutualism. 22:47 >> Uh-huh. 22:49 >> Yes, when that mutual relationship is 22:52 lopsided, then nationalism must emerge 22:54 to take a firm stance. 22:57 >> Uh-huh. Yes, simply put, "don't keep 23:02 fooling me," but modified with better 23:05 global communication language. "Uh, we 23:08 are prioritizing nationalism." I think 23:10 this is smart. 23:11 >> Uh-huh. You know. I mean, this is a 23:15 form of nationalism modified through 23:18 nationalist policies, modified through 23:22 rhetoric, yes, pleasant and good 23:26 rhetoric, you know. Polite, you know. 23:30 So Singapore is a small country, right. 23:35 >> Yes. But how much theft has been 23:37 committed by Singapore against this 23:39 nation? It’s not wrong, no, it’s 23:41 not solely Singapore's fault, it’s 23:43 also our officials' fault. 23:45 >> Uh-huh. 23:48 >> Let's say, tyranny would never happen 23:50 if the oppressed fought back, you know. 23:55 But the tyranny that happens is the 23:57 result of a compromise between the 23:58 oppressor and the oppressed, right? You 24:03 know. 24:03 >> Yes. Yes, it is time for bilateral 24:06 relations with, in particular, 24:08 Singapore to be evaluated. 24:12 Singapore’s land area keeps expanding 24:14 over time. And then, uh, they take the 24:18 sand from us. They wouldn't take our 24:22 sand if our officials didn't allow it. 24:27 What’s the result? I was just a while 24:29 ago to what’s it called? To several 24:31 areas, including Bali, or whatever, 24:32 it’s being eroded, right? So the area 24:38 of what? The area of the sea and the 24:40 area of the land should have been the 24:41 same as before. It should always be the 24:43 same, just shifting places. Why are we 24:44 the ones shifting from our place, from 24:46 Indonesia to Singapore, you know? This 24:51 is what must be noted, you know. Then 24:54 there is also, uh, what, transfer 24:56 pricing, right? 24:58 >> Uh-huh. And Singapore is the 25:00 perpetrator of that as well, right? So, 25:04 for example, exporting nickel to China 25:07 via Singapore first. The price to 25:09 Singapore is, uh, half of the price to 25:11 China. The money stops in Singapore. It 25:17 is time in this context that we support 25:19 the government in taking a firm stance, 25:21 but once again, it must be smart. You 25:27 know. So, it is roughly like this, 25:29 right. So we punish people in such a 25:32 way that they are happy to be punished 25:34 by us, you see. We punish people in a 25:36 way that they feel comfortable being 25:38 punished and do not feel punished by us 25:40 . This is what I think should be done, 25:42 not just toward Singapore, but toward 25:44 any country. When a bilateral 25:46 relationship harms us, where there is 25:49 an imbalance in mutualism, in the 25:51 symbiosis, then it must be evaluated. 25:55 In this context, the relationship 25:56 between Indonesia and Singapore must be 25:58 evaluated. 25:59 >> Hm. 26:01 >> Must be evaluated. So the methods used 26:04 by the government in this context 26:06 through the Ministry of Energy and 26:08 Mineral Resources, I think these are 26:10 ways that show nationalism is becoming 26:12 increasingly firm. Then this is 26:15 different from MSCI. 26:17 >> Yeah. I, frankly, my knowledge hasn't 26:21 reached that level yet. If we study, 26:25 for example, the Global Village by 26:28 Marshall McLuhan, and then Saskia 26:30 Sassen when talking about, uh, what, 26:33 global cities, right, where the market 26:36 is global, there isn't one region— 26:39 even though there are peripheries, 26:42 there is a core, there is a metropolis, 26:45 there are satellites—that is the 26:48 difference. However, the world has 26:51 become very small, especially in trade. 26:55 Then the one who has the standard for 26:57 investment, since investment is global 26:59 in nature, the one who has the standard 27:01 is MSCI. Then we say, okay, if 27:06 Indonesia is indeed capable with local 27:09 investment, with national investment, 27:12 if it is capable, then no problem, the 27:15 funds are enough to sustain, operate, 27:17 and turn the wheels of our economy. But 27:23 when our funds still depend on other 27:25 countries, investors from other parties 27:27 , and then we say, oh, we want to be 27:29 independent and have our own standards. 27:32 Well, this is where my knowledge hasn't 27:34 reached yet. 27:34 >> Right. 27:36 >> I need to learn a lot from those 27:37 economists. 27:38 >> Yes, Bang Ton. But is Indonesia strong 27:40 enough, Bang, in managing its own 27:42 energy resources so that domestic needs 27:44 do not have to compete with export 27:46 interests? Uh, of course, not 27:49 everything can be like that. Total 27:52 energy independence is also not 27:54 possible. How much oil do we even have, 27:56 right? What is our oil per day 28:00 requirement? It's 1.5 million barrels 28:05 per day. 28:06 >> Our oil is 600,000 barrels. Yeah. 28:09 >> Yes. Therefore, it needs gradual effort 28:14 ; the rumors that have appeared in the 28:17 community in Aceh about oil discoveries 28:20 are good. Well, just prove it. 28:23 >> Yes. 28:25 >> So, energy independence looks at our 28:28 capabilities, energy self-sufficiency 28:31 looks at our capabilities. Ah, this is 28:36 where we need to build smart bilateral 28:39 relations so that our position is not 28:42 always below. It must be apple-to-apple 28:45 . You need me, I need this, but you 28:49 need me for that. That's how it is. 28:52 That is why when a president meets 28:53 another president, what do they bring? 28:55 They bring. I will buy this from you. 28:58 But the condition is you buy this from 28:59 us. If not, I will move to another 29:01 country. There are still many others 29:03 who sell oil, not just you, for example 29:05 . There are still many who sell steel, 29:07 not just you. There are still many we 29:10 need, like that. But you must be here 29:13 so that our monetary situation is not 29:16 weak, not oppressed, you see. 29:19 >> Yes. That is why Mr. Bahlil is doing 29:22 that. 29:22 >> That is why Mr. Bahlil is looking for 29:24 fuel supplies to China and even India, 29:25 brother. So we don't depend on 29:27 Singapore. 29:29 >> Well, that is good. That is why the 29:32 players, these cartels, must be cleaned 29:35 up first. 29:37 >> Actually, all this time it’s the 29:38 cartels that have been playing. Why is 29:39 it cheaper over there, right? And then 29:42 why do we buy it here for more? Cartel 29:45 games. If over there we can barter, we 29:50 buy this and sell that, but here we 29:52 can't barter. Why do we take it here? 29:57 Ah, it needs to be planned, Indonesia 30:00 was once at 2,400 to 2,500 rupiah to 1 30:03 US dollar. 30:05 >> Can it be returned to that? Very 30:07 possible. Under Habibie, it immediately 30:09 returned drastically, it is possible. 30:10 >> Yes, very, very possible. If the 30:14 methods like Mr. Bahlil's are done 30:16 continuously, and the players are 30:18 starting to be removed, it is very 30:20 possible, Indonesia is rich. "Hey, you 30:24 need nickel from me, right?" Just 30:26 suppress the price like this. 30:30 >> Well, in that process, there shouldn't 30:33 be underpricing, there shouldn't be 30:35 unrecording, right. There shouldn't be 30:39 transfer pricing either. This is what 30:42 is currently the problem. 30:44 >> Uh-huh. 30:45 >> They buy from us, it's already 30:47 underpriced below value, and the money 30:49 is kept elsewhere. Ah, if all that 30:53 money enters Indonesia and the 30:54 resources eventually go through 30:56 downstreaming. If raw materials are all 30:59 according to price standards and money 31:02 circulates in Indonesia, then we can 31:04 fight the MSCI. 31:06 >> Uh-huh. Don't just be suppressed and 31:09 then fight back. Slowly, kill them off 31:12 first. When we are strong, we remove 31:15 them. We still remember what Raden 31:18 Wijaya did when founding Majapahit, 31:21 right? 31:22 >> Yes. 31:23 >> Annihilate Kediri, right. When 31:26 Singasari was coup-ed by Kediri, it was 31:28 also crushed, he couldn't have been 31:30 strong because Jaya Katwang was too big 31:32 . Who did he use then? He used the 31:35 Mongols. But after the Mongols helped, 31:37 "Oh, you want to colonize us? I'll wipe 31:40 you out first," roughly like that. 31:43 Alright, brother. 31:46 >> Yes, those making attempts to colonize 31:48 Indonesia, in quotes, in this context, 31:51 are economic, so we must fight back 31:53 intelligently; we must fight back with 31:55 all our strategic strengths. Alright, 31:59 Bang Toni. Lastly. 32:00 >> Mr. Pra's paradigm is already correct. 32:02 >> The paradigm. 32:03 >> Now it's just the implementation, right 32:04 . Just the implementation. Because of 32:07 that, my input to Mr. Prabowo is to 32:09 find human resources that have 32:11 competence. 32:13 >> Exactly, Bang. 32:14 >> Yes. Then also those who have integrity 32:16 , what is the basis? Meritocracy, not 32:18 colleagues. Yes, don't be like. 32:22 >> If, if, if later his colleague, have 32:23 the colleague intern there first until 32:25 they understand, are proficient, are 32:27 good at being a deputy, for example, 32:29 then being appointed is fine. 32:31 >> Yes. 32:32 >> But their competence must already meet 32:34 the standard. 32:35 >> Don't let it look like dividing up the 32:37 spoils, Bang. Yes, it's not just 32:39 looking like dividing the spoils. 32:40 >> Dividing the spoils. Alright, Bang Toni 32:42 . I want to move to the last topic, 32:45 Bang Toni. When the UK starts warning 32:48 its citizens to prepare for emergency 32:50 situations, and then Japan takes 32:52 similar steps, surely we need to ask 32:54 what kind of threat are these major 32:56 nations actually anticipating? Is the 33:00 world truly facing a geopolitical 33:02 situation so serious that society must 33:04 start preparing for the worst-case 33:06 scenario? The fundamental question is, 33:10 Bang, has the Indonesian government 33:12 read these warning signs? If there is 33:15 an escalation of global conflict that 33:17 disrupts energy supplies, food, and the 33:19 world economy, how prepared is 33:21 Indonesia to protect its people? Let's 33:24 not have a situation where the crisis 33:25 has already happened, and only then the 33:27 government gets busy anticipating it. 33:29 >> Look, if Saudi Arabia and the Houthis 33:33 are prolonged, America and Iran are 33:36 prolonged. Right. 33:37 >> Yeah. 33:38 >> Then Ukraine and Russia are prolonged. 33:43 >> Right. Is there any analysis that says 33:49 the world won't face a crisis? 33:53 >> Right. 33:55 >> It has already begun. If those wars are 33:57 not stopped. 33:59 >> Yeah, then a global crisis will happen. 34:02 Ah, it has already started. Where did 34:04 it start? It is currently in Europe. We 34:06 know European history, if one place 34:08 explodes, it will explode elsewhere. 34:11 >> Yes. France yesterday, sir? 34:13 >> France has already. 34:14 >> Yeah. 34:15 >> Yes. Then on to, uh, where is it next? 34:19 >> Spain. Spain. 34:21 >> Spain. 34:22 >> That will eventually go to Portugal. 34:24 >> Yes. 34:25 >> Down to Italy. 34:27 >> To the right to Germany, right. 34:30 >> Up to the Netherlands. Even though the 34:33 UK is off the island, there is a train 34:36 tunnel underneath it. 34:37 >> Yes. 34:39 >> Yes. And then, if there is a crisis 34:43 like that, as they say, if the UK is in 34:46 crisis, Tokyo is also in crisis. 34:50 >> Yeah. 34:50 >> So this world, its economic center, 34:54 like in Indonesia where 70%is in 34:57 Jakarta. For the world, it is in three 35:00 cities. Namely New York, Tokyo, and 35:04 London. Yes, if London is in crisis, 35:07 the other two places, Tokyo and the 35:08 like, will also be in crisis. 35:10 >> Yeah. We will return to that later. 35:12 >> If we are in crisis, Korea will also be 35:14 in crisis. Because Korea usually serves 35:16 as the Asian benchmark. 35:18 >> Now, Korea is... 35:22 >> its stocks, you know, in our terms, 35:24 they are crashing. 35:26 >> Hm. 35:28 >> They’ve already crashed. And usually, 35:30 if South Korea crashes, then Southeast 35:33 Asia will also crash. 35:35 >> Heh. 35:37 >> Yeah. It can be anticipated if, indeed, 35:41 this continues until 2027-2028, then 35:44 there is a possibility of a global 35:47 restructuring. Yes, the world is being 35:52 reshuffled, you know. 35:54 >> Yeah. Like that, a deconstruction 35:57 occurs, followed by a reconstruction of 36:00 the world order. Not just Indonesia, 36:05 can Indonesia then survive? It won't be 36:08 able to. If Europe collapses, 36:11 especially London, then it moves to 36:13 Japan, they crash, then to South Korea, 36:16 Indonesia will definitely be dragged 36:18 along. Ah, in my opinion, this is the 36:22 time to read the global situation; what 36:25 must Indonesia prepare? What is Plan A? 36:28 What is Plan B? What is Plan C, KI? Mr. 36:31 Prabowo is a military man, used to 36:34 using planning with alternatives. If 36:39 things remain stable like this, what is 36:40 Plan A? If later only Europe happens, 36:44 and Japan, what about that? But if 36:47 there is a world restructuring, a 36:49 global restriction, what must Indonesia 36:50 do? Take the momentum, yes. Every 36:54 crisis always has momentum, you know. 36:56 For those who understand the 36:58 opportunity, they will rise. But for 37:00 those who don't want to, they will fall 37:02 . Ah, can Indonesia read that? Yes, if 37:08 it really happens, what opportunity 37:10 does Indonesia want to build? 37:12 >> Yeah. 37:14 >> So that currently, Indonesia becomes at 37:17 least a semi-peripheral country, right? 37:21 Sort of half-behind, right? Not 37:23 reaching the point of underdevelopment, 37:25 not becoming a country that isn't 37:27 counted, this Indonesia. But how can it 37:31 then take a role, a global role? The 37:35 world is always being reshuffled, for 37:38 example, Rome, Italy, then France with 37:41 Germany at that time, then it moved to 37:43 France and England, right? England 37:47 moved to America and China, right, 37:49 that's how it is. 37:51 >> Yes. 37:51 >> Yeah. But if we say, what if this is 37:55 reconstructed and then Indonesia 37:57 emerges? 37:59 >> Yes. It's hard to answer that because 38:04 there are no indicators yet for 38:05 Indonesia to step up and take that 38:07 position. 38:09 >> He. Alright. Because indeed, in the 38:11 midst of this increasingly complex 38:13 global uncertainty, Bang. The 38:15 government and the people must unite. 38:18 The ulama and the umarah (leaders) must 38:19 walk side by side. We must not be 38:21 divided by differences, but must 38:23 strengthen unity, build national 38:25 independence, and together anticipate 38:28 various threats to maintain the safety, 38:30 stability, and future of Indonesia. 38:33 >> The key to unity lies with the 38:35 government, with those in power. 38:37 >> Yeah. If the leaders are righteous, 38:41 embrace everyone, are not corrupt, are 38:43 fair, and provide welfare—genuinely 38:46 oriented toward welfare and working for 38:49 it—and the people see measurable 38:51 efforts to improve their lives, then 38:54 there will be peace. Indonesia is a 38:58 very, very, very peaceful country, you 39:00 know. If there is conflict, it is 39:03 because the political elite creates the 39:04 noise. So, we shouldn't just position 39:08 ourselves as preachers. Pastors or 39:11 Islamic scholars talking about how we 39:13 must live in peace. Goodness, that's 39:16 meaningless. 39:18 >> That [peace] originates from the 39:20 government, from those in power. If the 39:23 leaders are fair, there is peace. If 39:25 the leaders embrace everyone, there is 39:28 peace. 39:28 >> Yes. Even if an angel were to come as a 39:33 preacher promoting peace, if the 39:35 leaders’ policies and narratives do 39:38 not create peace, it won't be peaceful. 39:42 The adage is, "people follow the ways 39:44 of their leaders." Whether society is 39:47 in conflict or at peace depends on the 39:50 leaders; issues of morality, corruption 39:52 , integrity, and capacity all depend on 39:55 the leaders. 39:57 >> That’s how it is, Mas Agus, so I am 39:59 truly convinced that if we have good 40:01 leaders, this country will be good. If 40:04 we have bad leaders, this country will 40:06 be bad. The fate of this nation depends 40:09 on its leaders. If they say it’s not 40:10 easy to run this nation, it indeed 40:12 isn't easy. Anyone who wants to be a 40:14 leader in this country must understand 40:16 the issues, and that is not easy. If 40:18 you feel capable, then step forward. If 40:20 you don't feel capable, don't. Don't. 40:22 And then complain after you have 40:23 stepped forward. 40:24 >> That's not allowed. 40:25 >> Yes. Because a position is a sacred 40:27 trust. Alright, Bang Toni, we are at 40:29 the end of the show. Thank you very 40:33 much, Bang Toni, for the message and 40:35 also, what do you call it? Our dialogue 40:38 today. Perhaps a final message, Bang 40:40 Toni. 40:41 >> Yes. First, we must be objective. 40:47 Second, we must care about this nation, 40:49 about this country. Being objective 40:51 means we must support what is good. 40:53 >> Yeah. 40:54 >> It must be good. Government policies 40:56 and programs should be supported, yes. 40:59 The bad things must be corrected. This 41:01 is being objective. Then the second is 41:03 having concern. You cannot stay silent. 41:04 Don't be like a donkey. As Jalaluddin 41:07 Rumi said. What? A donkey will bray if 41:14 it is hungry itself. But if others or 41:16 its neighbors are hungry, it stays 41:17 silent. So, what are we? Indonesian 41:20 society is a civilized society, not a 41:23 society of donkeys. A society that must 41:26 have concern for this nation, for the 41:28 future of this country, and naturally 41:31 for the children and grandchildren we 41:33 will leave behind. Leave behind, yes. 41:36 >> And then third, third, we must 41:42 continuously work together to...... 41:51 together think about the future of this 41:52 nation. 41:53 >> Yes. So let this not only be, uh, the 41:57 responsibility of those in power, the 42:00 country's leaders, but we must also 42:02 take responsibility for what happens in 42:04 this country. 42:07 >> Right. 42:07 >> That's how it is. Uh, let's cast aside 42:10 all hatred. Uh, prioritize the nation's 42:13 interest above our own, above the 42:15 interests of groups, above the 42:17 interests of parties. If political 42:21 parties can prioritize the national 42:22 interest over party interests, that 42:24 would be extraordinary. Like that last 42:27 speech by SBY, the country comes first, 42:29 the party comes later. And that must 42:32 indeed be proven. 42:33 >> Right. If all parties put the country 42:36 first, above party interests, then this 42:39 country will certainly become much 42:42 better. 42:44 >> Very well, Bang Toni. Thank you very 42:46 much, Bang Toni. Assalamu'alaikum 42:49 warahmatullahi wabarakatuh. 42:50 Wa'alaikumussalam warahmatullahi 42:52 wabarakatuh. 
