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0:08 Rasil TV but rather from daily 0:24 experiences when dealing with the 0:27 police, starting from processing 0:29 documents, reporting, to asking for 0:31 help. Therefore, tonight we will 0:34 explore how this leadership transition 0:37 can be translated into real service 0:39 reform so that there is no gap between 0:41 the vision at the leadership level and 0:44 the reality on the ground. For that, 0:47 tonight we have with us our Indonesia 0:49 Stocks guests, the first being Mr. 0:50 Yusuf Warsim, a member of the National 0:52 Police Commission (Kompolnas). Peace be 0:55 upon you, Mr. Yusuf. And peace be upon 0:57 you too, and Allah's mercy and 0:58 blessings. 0:59 >> Yes, thank you for being here. 1:01 >> Praise be to God. How is everyone? 1:04 >> Praise be to God. Then we also have our 1:08 host for Indonesia Stocks, Mr. Mardani 1:11 Ali Sera. Peace be upon you, Mr. 1:13 Mardani. 1:14 >> And peace be upon you too, brother 1:15 Hardi, brother Yusuf. Thank you all. 1:20 And later, God willing, hopefully 1:22 brother Haris Azhar and Mr. Dahlan 1:24 Iskan will join us soon. God willing. 1:28 Now, friends, before we start this 1:30 Indonesia Stocks program, we would like 1:33 to express our deepest gratitude to all 1:35 Indonesia Stocks viewers, both 1:37 domestically and abroad. And to our 1:40 colleagues in the media and journalists 1:43 who are always watching our program. 1:47 This Indonesia Stocks program can be 1:49 watched right now live via live 1:51 streaming on the Mardani Ali Sera and 1:54 Rasil TV YouTube channels, and is also 1:56 relayed through the Rasil radio network 1:59 . For those of you in the Greater 2:03 Jakarta area, you are welcome to listen 2:06 via the Rasil 720 AM radio broadcast, 2:09 and it is also relayed in several 2:11 cities on networks connected to the 2:13 Rasil radio network throughout 2:15 Indonesia. Alright, friends, let's 2:19 start our discussion tonight regarding 2:22 the new Chief of National Police. Mr. 2:25 Mardani, please provide your 2:27 introduction and initial views. 2:31 Permission, brother Yusuf, to give an 2:33 introduction. 2:34 >> In the name of Allah, the Most Gracious 2:35 , the Most Merciful. Peace be upon you, 2:36 and Allah's mercy and blessings. Praise 2:40 be to God. O Allah, bestow peace upon 2:42 our master Muhammad. Furthermore. Good 2:45 evening. Peace be upon us all. 2:50 President Prabowo took a very 2:53 extraordinary step on October 1st which 2:56 immediately had an impact, namely the 3:00 replacement of the Chief of the 3:02 Indonesian National Police. On that day 3:08 , brother Yusuf, I posted. Welcome 3:12 brother Suyudi and farewell brother 3:15 Sigit or brother Listyo Sigit. We in 3:20 the House of Representatives were 3:23 fortunate that the replacement process 3:27 went suddenly but smoothly. To me, this 3:32 is a good precedent. Yes, everyone is 3:37 very aware that the National Police is 3:39 a large institution. The National 3:44 Police is an institution that plays a 3:46 vital role in maintaining security, 3:49 comfort, and public order. And the 3:52 police are also very close. Moreover 3:57 the new Police Chief brother Suyudi 4:02 reminds us that the police are with the 4:04 community. A tagline that to me, 4:09 brother Yusuf, is very simple but also 4:13 very fundamental. A police force that 4:18 is ostentatious, grand, and luxurious 4:21 means nothing if it is not with the 4:23 community. Therefore, appreciation to 4:27 the new Police Chief for a theme that 4:30 is simple but fundamental and 4:32 substantial. Of course, Mr. Prabowo had 4:38 many considerations for choosing 4:40 brother Suyudi. But indeed, uh, Mas 4:44 Listyo Sigit, uh, that is, uh, Mas 4:55 Sigit has indeed been there for almost 4:58 5 years and 9 months, right, Mas Yusuf, 5:00 right, Mas Listyo Sigit, so, uh, his 5- 5:03 year and 9-month contribution, uh, has 5:06 many notes. But personally, I assess 5:11 that Indonesia is safe, Indonesia is 5:13 peaceful, and, uh, both Mr. Jokowi and 5:16 Mr. Prabowo can carry out their 5:18 development agendas. I have three notes 5:22 regarding, uh, this new National Police 5:25 Chief transition. The first one, the 5:29 most mandatory thing is to truly 5:32 realize, uh, a police force that is 5:35 loved, yes. Not just close, but loved. 5:39 There should no longer be a view that 5:42 seeing the police is frightening, that 5:45 the police make, uh, the public feel 5:48 worried or anxious. Instead, seeing the 5:54 police should be like seeing clerics, 5:58 seeing, uh, doctors, seeing, uh, 6:01 servants, namely people whose existence 6:05 is appreciated. It is not easy. But the 6:12 six recommendations from the police 6:15 acceleration team, the police reform 6:18 led by Mr. Jimly Asshiddiqie, in my 6:21 view, already contain, uh, the main 6:23 points, but the devil is in the details 6:27 . Now, because of that, to support, uh, 6:31 the new National Police Chief, Mas Yudi 6:33 , making a paradigm shift, a character 6:39 change, uh, a cultural change is not 6:42 easy because, indeed, the police are, 6:45 uh, very long-standing. The police are, 6:50 uh, full of, uh, the police are full of 7:00 , uh, very large divisions, so what 7:03 might happen, uh, is there will be 7:07 obstacles in the chain of command and 7:10 so on. Lastly, the third one, Ma'am. 7:24 The third one, certainly, Bang Heldy, 7:28 my view is, uh, our police force is 7:31 mature enough, and therefore, uh, a 7:35 police force that is capable of not 7:38 only providing a sense of peace but 7:41 playing a role in increasing, uh, 7:45 investment and economic growth. by way 7:49 of law enforcement. Because there is 7:54 not a single developed country that 7:57 does not have a professional police 7:59 force that is pro-justice. Where, of 8:04 course, uh, justice is not just the 8:06 police, right, there are friends from 8:08 the prosecutor's office, there are, uh, 8:10 friends from the judiciary and others. 8:13 Therefore, in point three, the police 8:15 are not just, uh, close to the 8:16 community or the police being with the 8:18 community. But also, in accordance with 8:22 Mr. Prabowo's hopes, Indonesia has been 8:25 in the middle-income trap countries for 8:27 too long. Yes, we must immediately 8:31 become a country that has, uh, 8:34 professional apparatus who are not 8:37 corrupt, who are pro, uh, to investment 8:40 , and of course, uh, can realize, uh, 8:44 how the community grows and develops so 8:47 that Indonesia becomes a developed 8:50 country. That's the introduction, Bang 8:54 Heldy. 8:57 >> All right, thank you. Mr. Mardani, for 8:59 the introduction. Now, we want to hear 9:03 from Mr. Yusuf Warsim, how, uh, is the 9:05 change, but it seems we are getting new 9:08 hope regarding the Indonesian National 9:10 Police in the future. Mr. Yusuf, the 9:14 floor is yours. 9:16 >> All right. Peace be upon you, and 9:19 Allah's mercy and blessings. 9:21 >> Peace be upon you, too. Thank you, uh, 9:25 Bang Mardani for the insight that has 9:29 been 9:32 >> We at Kompolnas are pleased to join our 9:36 activities related to the Indonesian 9:40 Leaders Talk, with the theme of the new 9:44 National Police Chief, which is 9:47 certainly still relevant and 9:50 interesting. It is just that, if 9:55 observed, the current issue that is 9:57 most prominent overshadows other things 10:00 ; in terms of political issues, it 10:02 relates to the Constitutional Court's 10:04 decision regarding diplomas, uh The 10:09 Vice President. Well, therefore, uh the 10:16 change of the National Police Chief by 10:19 President Prabowo, uh, we are grateful 10:24 that Bang Mardani brought up this issue 10:28 . Meaning, uh, in the midst of a sudden 10:35 and quiet atmosphere 10:39 >> suddenly shaking, this is still 10:42 >> Sudden and quiet. Uh, but, through Bang 10:45 Mardani, this change of the National 10:49 Police Chief has become a concern, and 10:53 ideally, our role at Kompolnas is to 10:57 maintain meritocracy regarding the 11:01 change of the National Police Chief, 11:05 including ensuring there is room for 11:09 public participation. Certainly, once 11:16 again, we congratulate General Yudi 11:19 Arya Seto. Welcome uh, as the new 11:24 National Police Chief, and we also 11:26 express our gratitude for the service, 11:32 efforts, and hard work of Police 11:35 General Listyo Sigit Prabowo for 5.8 11:39 years. 11:40 >> Yes. I 11:41 >> through the transformation of a precise 11:43 National Police. So, as it happens, I 11:46 myself, as a member of Kompolnas, am in 11:50 my second term, having previously 11:54 served in the 2020-2024 period, and 11:59 since 2024, I have just entered my 12:02 second year, which will end in 2028. H 12:08 >> General Listyo Sigit Prabowo was one of 12:10 the National Police Chief candidates 12:12 that we decided upon through monitoring 12:19 activities to produce candidates for 12:22 National Police Chief in 2020, where at 12:29 that time, Police General Idham Azis 12:33 was entering retirement in January 2021 12:38 . Now, Mr. Listyo was one of the five 12:43 candidates we submitted to the 12:45 President. So, it is natural that his 12:54 tenure lasted for 5.8 years. Because 13:02 when we nominated and proposed 13:05 recommendations for the National Police 13:09 Chief candidate to the President at 13:13 that time, the youngest was indeed Mr. 13:16 Listyo Sigit, who, based on Law Number 13:20 2 of 2002 before the third amendment, 13:24 had a retirement age of 58. Thus, Mr. 13:30 Sigit's retirement, if based on the law 13:33 before the third amendment, would have 13:35 been in May 2027. So, that was indeed a 13:41 consideration, that such a long period 13:47 would at least at that time complete 13:53 the major task of securing the 2024 13:58 election implementation 14:03 >> which included the presidential 14:05 election, legislative election, and 14:07 also the simultaneous regional head 14:09 elections. So, this was a major concern 14:14 for us, that if the President appointed 14:20 Mr. Listyo Sigit, the time frame 14:24 related to his service period until 14:29 2027 would certainly be exceeded 14:34 because it would enter the 2024 14:38 election period. So, if a change were 14:44 to occur, it was our consideration at 14:46 that time that it would be after the 14:48 2024 election. Actually, the signal for 14:54 a change after the election was already 14:57 visible at that time. Then Kompolnas 15:03 received information that the President 15:08 would continue with Mr. Listyo Sigit at 15:12 the end of 2024 to remain as National 15:17 Police Chief, whose performance will 15:21 continue to be monitored. So, after the 15:28 end of 2024, we see that, at the latest 15:34 , if there are no amendments to the 15:40 National Police Law, and everything 15:46 runs smoothly, he could potentially 15:52 serve his term until May 2027. That was 15:58 around 2000. So, entering the year 2025 16:04 , we have already started to prepare 16:09 and refine our instruments. Kompolnas 16:13 happens to have an instrument called 16:18 the National Police Chief candidate 16:23 portfolio index, which monitors 16:27 high-ranking officers from two-star 16:32 Inspector Generals up to three-star 16:37 Commissioner Generals. We are 16:42 monitoring this, so if it appears that 16:47 the President is going to make a change 16:51 , our calculation is that by the end of 16:55 2026, the candidate portfolio index 16:59 will be complete. Our way of assessing 17:04 and creating the candidate portfolio 17:07 index for high-ranking officers is for 17:09 those with the rank of Inspector 17:12 General and Commissioner General of 17:14 Police. The first dimension is 17:18 individual competence. Within that, the 17:21 sub-dimensions include performance, 17:24 integrity, and capacity. Then the 17:28 second dimension is leadership. This 17:31 includes crisis management and 17:35 emotional maturity. And also the 17:40 ability to build partnerships and 17:43 cooperation. That is leadership. Then 17:48 the third dimension is strategic 17:49 contribution. What have they done 17:53 during their time as a National Police 17:56 member that constitutes a strategic 17:58 contribution to the police force and 18:00 the community? Those sub-dimensions 18:07 have 37 indicators, consisting of 18:11 administrative data, factual data, and 18:15 data based on public perception. So, 18:23 our way of scoring these two-star and 18:26 three-star high-ranking officers 18:29 involves public participation in the 18:32 scoring process. This includes how 18:37 their track record is perceived by the 18:40 public during their time as police 18:42 members in positions such as Chief of 18:45 Police, Regional Police Chief, and so 18:48 on. Deputy Regional Police Chief. That 18:52 is what we look at, how public 18:54 perception was during those strategic 18:56 assignments in leading the police in 18:58 the regions. From there, we generate a 19:03 top 30 ranking, and those 30 are 19:07 refined through expert judgment 19:11 activities, FGDs, and public 19:15 participation to provide suggestions 19:19 and input on the 30 names. For now, we 19:24 haven't decided on the 30 names yet, 19:28 Bang Ali. Yes, Bang Mardani. Now, 19:32 before we decided on those 30 names 19:36 >> indeed, before we decided on the 30 19:40 names, Police General Suyudi A. had 19:44 already been included in the list to be 19:48 scored. It’s just that we hadn't 19:52 finalized the scoring yet. Suddenly, 19:56 unexpectedly, the President, perhaps 19:59 with all the strategic considerations 20:03 he believes in directly nominated Mr. 20:10 Suyudi to Commission III to obtain 20:14 approval. Well, perhaps that strategic 20:18 situation is something we would have 20:21 matured by the end of this year, two 20:23 years into President Prabowo and Vice 20:26 President Gibran's term, actually. So, 20:30 entering 2027, if we base it on Mr. 20:34 Sigit's early retirement age of 58, 20:39 when the President asks who Kompolnas 20:44 recommends, we would be prepared with 20:48 solid data. So, in this case, we 20:52 certainly respect it because the 20:55 appointment of the National Police 20:57 Chief is the President's prerogative, 20:59 even though in our constitutional 21:01 system, it must receive approval from 21:04 Commission III of the House of 21:06 Representatives or the House itself, 21:08 and that has been done. Now, moving 21:13 forward, in the one week since the 21:18 inauguration and the handover of office 21:23 , we have observed that it is clearly 21:28 evident that there is an assertion that 21:33 Police General Suyudi, our new Chief, 21:40 wants to ensure he is not overshadowed 21:45 by the performance of the previous 5.8- 21:50 year term of Mr. Listyo, so 21:55 >> very true 21:56 >> he immediately changed the tagline, 21:59 which we had already been briefed on 22:02 since the fit and proper test at 22:05 Commission III, that our new Chief's 22:08 tagline is "Police with the Community." 22:13 This is certainly meant to emphasize on 22:17 one hand that he is not burdened by the 22:20 strength of the previous 5.8-year term 22:23 of Mr. Listyo Sigit with the "Polri 22:26 Presisi" tagline. Yes, even so, this " 22:31 Police with the Community" tagline can 22:35 still be said to be a continuation 22:38 because, at the time of Bhayangkara Day 22:42 this year and the previous year in 2025 22:45 , the Police themselves built a tagline 22:49 as a commitment, perhaps partly due to 22:54 the many criticisms during Mr. Listyo 22:58 Sigit Prabowo's term, so the "Police 23:02 for the Community" tagline was created. 23:07 So, with the new Chief, this "Police 23:10 with the Community" actually further 23:13 strengthens the commitment that the new 23:17 Chief wants to build, emphasizing that 23:20 this siding with the community is 23:23 highlighted through that new tagline. 23:29 We ourselves, during the August 2025 23:31 event that sparked the pressure and 23:34 spotlight on what is called Police 23:36 reform, have seen the Commission for 23:39 Accelerating Reform established by the 23:41 President, and its six recommendations 23:44 are already in place. Actually, at the 23:50 time of the August 2025 event, we 23:54 already saw that the Police had to 23:58 assert themselves amidst such strong 24:03 pressure. The first is the 24:07 repositioning of the state system. The 24:11 National Police is no longer under the 24:14 president, but under a ministry or even 24:17 subordinate to a ministry. Well, that. 24:20 Well, 24:21 >> enough 24:21 >> that is what is quite visible. So, when 24:24 that was so strong, we once offered a 24:27 suggestion, and I even stated it 24:30 publicly, that in facing those demands, 24:33 the National Police should immediately 24:36 assert that the police are with the 24:39 community and for the community. So, 24:43 that is what will be able to convince 24:46 and provide a guarantee of public trust 24:49 in the National Police, that without 24:53 repositioning the police in the state 24:56 system—not under the president but 24:59 under a ministry—the affirmation and 25:02 guarantee that the police are with the 25:05 community will give hope to the public 25:08 without needing a repositioning. The 25:12 National Police will be with the 25:14 community. Well, it turns out, thank 25:16 God, General Suyudi is committed. And 25:21 this is certainly what we will monitor, 25:24 we will oversee, and we will provide 25:27 suggestions and recommendations, as to 25:30 how far the programs intended by this " 25:34 Police with the Community" commitment 25:37 go; yes, we will oversee it. At the 25:42 very least, there are three things that 25:45 we need to look at regarding General 25:47 Suyudi's leadership with his "Police 25:50 with the Community" tagline. First, one 25:55 must be able and brave enough to change 25:58 the measures of success. It is not 26:03 about how to build a posture of 26:06 strength, for example, massive 26:08 facilities and infrastructure in 26:11 physical form. Success should no longer 26:17 be measured by the number of cases or 26:21 case handling, but rather how success 26:24 is based on indicators of the extent to 26:28 which the services provided by the 26:32 police to the community are not fragile 26:35 when satisfaction and trust index 26:39 surveys are conducted; it should not be 26:43 fluctuating, but stable. Based on the 26:48 current Kompas Research and Development 26:53 results, around August, before the 26:57 recent riots occurred again, it was 27:01 around 80%, although Indikator 27:05 Indonesia stated it was 76%. However, 27:10 we see that anything which is always 27:12 fluctuating is fragile. It is fragile. 27:18 When there are riots, or when there is 27:21 handling of demonstrations that result 27:23 in casualties, that is certain to 27:26 happen. If we want to get numbers and 27:30 rely on survey figures, they will 27:32 definitely drop. Likewise, when there 27:36 are cases of misconduct or violations 27:40 by members. Moreover, if it involves 27:44 high-ranking officers, like the Ferdy 27:47 or Teddy Minahasa cases, it 27:49 immediately plummets; it immediately 27:51 drops. That is how fragile it is. So, 27:55 this is what must really be changed, 27:58 having the courage to change the 28:01 indicators of success based on, if it's 28:05 the police alongside the community, how 28:09 satisfied and trusting the community is 28:12 . For example, in terms of time. When 28:17 people come to make a complaint or a 28:23 report, it should be fast. So, people 28:29 feel satisfied and trust it right then 28:32 and there. The case should not 28:36 experience any delays or setbacks, for 28:40 example, not like the situation a while 28:44 ago where a police precinct in the 28:47 Banten area was considered unwilling to 28:51 serve. So, it must be service-based. 28:55 Success is what must be pursued with 28:59 the courage to change, because the 29:02 tagline is police with the community, 29:06 so the quality of service must be 29:09 improved. Whether that service is 29:12 manual or, as currently demanded, 29:15 digital, which of course cannot be 29:18 everywhere because there are remote 3T 29:21 areas. So, it can certainly be manual, 29:25 and the demands of digital 29:27 transformation can also be met. 29:31 Secondly, the courage to be 29:33 continuously supervised. One of the 29:36 things that most often comes under the 29:42 spotlight and can quickly erode public 29:45 trust is the use of force. The use of 29:50 force can indeed be supervised. It can 29:53 be supervised. Yes, that. Including, in 29:59 terms of supervision, strengthening 30:01 high-risk-based oversight. If we are 30:06 asked what the high-risk zones in the 30:10 National Police are, we have tried to 30:13 cluster at least five. The first 30:17 high-risk zone is the performance of 30:19 criminal investigation units. We are 30:23 basing this on Kompolnas data. Because 30:26 the highest number of complaints 30:29 submitted by the public to Kompolnas 30:31 concerns the performance of 30:33 investigations and inquiries. Secondly, 30:37 and this might be relevant to Police 30:40 General Suyudi, who previously served 30:43 as head of the BNN, another high-risk 30:47 zone is related to drugs. This includes 30:53 cases involving members that fall into 30:58 this high-risk zone. Therefore, this is 31:03 highly relevant and has a strong 31:05 connection to Mr. Suyudi due to his 31:07 background as head of the BNN. Thirdly, 31:11 the high-risk zone is traffic police. 31:15 This is the face of the police, seen 31:19 daily in traffic. How to ensure it is 31:23 supervised so there are no more 31:26 complaints about illegal levies on the 31:29 road. The courage to be supervised in 31:33 traffic, for example, by wearing body 31:35 cams. Although, actually, for the 31:38 Jakarta area, the congestion is already 31:41 extraordinary, Mr. Mar Ali. Yes, 31:44 traffic lights as the law 31:46 >> do not function maximally, so police 31:48 must use discretion. That traffic 31:50 police work. 31:51 >> Yes. Sometimes they even let traffic 31:54 flow. Correct. 31:55 >> Yes. Yes. So this is, uh, then this is 31:58 a high-risk zone. Then the fifth is, uh 32:02 , functions related to detention and 32:04 evidence. Now, for example, the TM case 32:07 in the past was related to evidence. 32:10 Now, that's just the last one, the, uh, 32:13 fifth, uh, uh, a high-risk zone that 32:17 must truly have strong oversight and 32:20 supervision, yes, regarding the 32:23 security standards for, uh, 32:25 demonstrations, which always, uh, 32:28 receive scrutiny and criticism, uh, 32:30 from August 2025, which, related to the 32:34 handling of demonstrations, then gave 32:37 rise to, uh, demands for police reform 32:40 because there was a victim, uh, Afan, 32:43 who was run over by a Brimob tactical 32:45 vehicle at that time. Now, this must be 32:48 courageously supervised. Now, 32:51 especially, uh, creating, uh, high-risk 32:54 zone oversight. So give anyone access 32:57 to be able to supervise that, yes, 32:59 criticism. Now, in the fit and proper 33:03 test, they must be very open to 33:06 accepting any criticism. Even don't 33:10 always look at the positive survey data 33:13 , but look at the, uh, bad survey data. 33:17 That is what must be continuously 33:18 observed. Now, I think this is a new 33:20 hope to be able to accept criticism. 33:22 Now, then the, uh, third one is related 33:25 to, uh, education. Because of what was 33:30 meant by Bang Mardani earlier, uh, and 33:33 host reform. Now, our emphasis relates 33:38 to the recommendations from the KPRP 33:40 and we ourselves have previously often 33:43 conveyed that what is experiencing a 33:46 slowdown, uh, is reform if referred to 33:49 post-98; structural, instrumental, and 33:52 cultural reform. This cultural reform 33:56 is what is experiencing, uh, no, uh, 33:58 acceleration, uh, acceleration. Now, so 34:03 in the, uh, third dimension, to, uh, 34:06 carry out, uh, homework for, uh, change 34:09 , uh, this cultural reform is what must 34:12 be the focus 34:15 >> of the new police chief. Now, this 34:18 >> aspect is in education. Now, because, 34:22 now, we have surveyed the year, we have 34:25 conducted research in 2022. How, 34:29 actually, if we talk about 34:32 institutional oversight, strategic 34:35 oversight. Now, then there is inherent 34:39 oversight which is, uh, leadership. Now 34:43 , out of these three, uh, oversight 34:45 instruments, the institutional one is 34:48 already extraordinarily numerous. Bang 34:51 Mardani. There is Kompolnas, there is 34:53 Komnas HAM. If it's about human rights, 34:55 there is also the DPR. Commission 3, 34:57 which, uh, in recent times has been 34:59 very active in summoning the Regional 35:02 Police Chiefs and District Police 35:04 Chiefs. Now, but there is inherent 35:06 oversight which is actually the most 35:08 strategic and most decisive because we 35:10 surveyed the role of National Police 35:12 leadership in preventing, uh, 35:13 violations. So this leadership is very, 35:17 very important to receive attention 35:19 through the aspect of, uh, National 35:22 Police leadership education. Yeah, 35:25 there is, uh, Sespima, there is 35:27 SESPIMen, there is SESPIMTI. Now, this 35:31 must, uh, be the, uh, instrument for 35:34 how cultural reform is carried out. The 35:38 , uh, first is through, uh, what is the 35:42 most primary and strategic, in my 35:45 opinion, which is in, uh, leadership 35:49 education. Now, because, uh, within 35:52 organizational culture, leadership is 35:55 actually a subculture. Well, when we 35:58 conducted research on the role of 36:01 leadership, leadership became the 36:03 dominant culture in the organization, 36:05 in the organizational culture of the 36:08 National Police. Therefore, the 36:12 integrity and example set by leadership 36:15 are very decisive in how the 36:18 acceleration of cultural reform within 36:21 the National Police organization can be 36:25 truly significant, visible, and felt. 36:30 At least when it is linked to the duty 36:33 of protecting and serving. A culture of 36:36 protecting and serving quickly and 36:38 precisely. And including how to ensure 36:42 that justice for the public can be 36:45 fulfilled. Now, this relates to 36:49 cultural reform, which we need to 36:52 continue to prioritize based on the 36:55 recommendations of the Reform 36:57 Acceleration Commission, specifically 37:00 regarding how to improve leadership 37:03 education within the Police so that a 37:06 change in organizational culture will 37:09 truly occur. Perhaps that is important. 37:14 Besides continuing what has been built 37:18 over the past 5.8 years by Mr. Sigit, 37:21 one of the strongest aspects is digital 37:24 transformation. That is what needs to 37:29 be continued and strengthened. Finally, 37:34 everything being done cannot be 37:37 separated from the grand strategy 37:40 already owned by the Police, namely the 37:43 grand strategy from 2025 to 2045, 37:46 leading to the Golden Indonesia vision. 37:50 That is the 20-year grand strategy of 37:52 the National Police. There are three 37:54 stages of achievement to be reached 37:56 within the Police grand strategy. We 38:00 ourselves, at the National Police 38:02 Commission (Kompolnas), have the task 38:05 of proposing police policy directions 38:07 to the President every year, and we 38:09 always provide recommendations, which 38:12 this year— 38:15 >> Coincidentally, with Mr. Suyudi, the 38:17 former Head of the National Narcotics 38:20 Agency (BNN), we provided a policy 38:22 direction to prioritize law enforcement 38:24 against narcotics crime syndicates. To 38:28 be able to dismantle the network. The 38:32 success of uncovering narcotics crimes 38:36 is not just about the number of 38:39 suspects and evidence, but success must 38:42 involve capturing the perpetrators and 38:46 main controllers, the key kingpin 38:49 actors. Now, the second point is the 38:53 strengthening of asset tracing 38:55 strategies. Especially if Mr. Mardani 38:59 soon approves the Asset Forfeiture Law, 39:01 it will align with our proposal for 39:04 strategy strengthening. 39:06 >> Correct. Correct. The eradication of 39:08 syndicates must be backed by a 39:10 strengthening of asset tracing. That is 39:13 what we always provide, and this year, 39:16 what we conveyed to the President 39:18 aligns and has strong relevance with 39:20 Mr. Suyudi, who was previously the Head 39:23 of the BNN. I think that serves as— 39:28 — 39:28 >> my introduction. 39:32 >> Peace be upon you, and Allah's mercy 39:34 and blessings. 39:34 >> And peace be upon you too. 39:36 >> And peace be upon you too. Thank you. 39:38 Thank you. 39:39 >> Thank you, Mr. Yusuf, and thankfully, 39:41 Mr. Dahlan Iskan has joined us. Peace 39:43 be upon you, Mr. Dahlan. Yes. Mr. 39:49 Dahlan, welcome. Tonight we are 39:51 discussing the change of leadership in 39:54 the National Police. We have a new 39:56 National Police Chief. There are many 39:58 expectations regarding his new 40:00 performance. Especially since he 40:03 carries the concept of the police being 40:04 with the people, right? Among the 40:07 community. And at the beginning of his 40:10 tenure as National Police Chief, he has 40:12 already made many breakthroughs, both 40:15 those he has done and those he will do. 40:18 How does Mr. Dahlan view the new 40:20 National Police Chief who has been 40:22 chosen by President Prabowo and 40:24 approved by the House of 40:25 Representatives? 40:29 >> Frankly, I have high hopes. 40:32 >> Yes, Sir. I have great expectations 40:35 because his track record is good. I 40:39 mean, I don't interact with him 40:42 directly, but I have many journalists I 40:46 can communicate with, you see. I also 40:51 congratulated him, and he immediately 40:54 replied with thanks and so on. Now, 40:58 what impresses me is that he was so 41:01 brave in eradicating thuggery when he 41:05 was the Banten Regional Police Chief. 41:10 Banten is the center of "jawara"(local 41:16 strongmen) and thugs there had been 41:21 unsettling business people. And we all 41:27 still remember that the head of the 41:29 Banten Chamber of Commerce was arrested 41:31 during his time as Police Chief. The 41:33 Chamber of Commerce head. At that time, 41:38 we all remember that this head of the 41:41 Chamber of Commerce demanded that 41:44 project owners in Banten give him 41:47 projects worth 5 trillion. Well, the 41:52 project itself was worth tens of 41:54 trillions, so perhaps the assumption 41:57 was that giving him 5 trillion would be 41:59 fine. But this had greatly unsettled 42:04 business people, the business climate 42:07 became very poor, and he made the 42:10 Chamber of Commerce head a suspect, and 42:14 during his time as Police Chief, nearly 42:17 500 thugs were arrested. Meanwhile, we 42:23 want high economic growth and a good 42:28 investment climate, but entrepreneurs 42:33 feel that thuggery comes from various 42:37 directions, including mass 42:41 organizations and all sorts of 42:45 uniformed groups, so will what happened 42:51 in Banten happen throughout Indonesia? 42:57 Meaning that the investment climate 43:00 will become much better because no one 43:03 is interfering with investments. 43:09 Because, for example, foreign 43:10 entrepreneurs certainly don't know what 43:13 these organizations are, and then there 43:15 are those levies; they feel they have 43:17 already paid, yet they still have to 43:19 pay again and again. All of which is 43:24 troublesome, especially for one's peace 43:26 of mind; in terms of money, it might 43:29 not be much, but in terms of certainty 43:32 and the hassle, it is extremely 43:34 bothersome. I think that's all for now. 43:38 So my hope is that this will also 43:41 extend to eradicating thugs who disrupt 43:45 the investment climate. Thank you. 43:50 >> Alright, thank you, Mr. Dahlan. Now we 43:54 go to Mr. Marani. Mr. Marani, perhaps 43:57 you can look at this from a strategic 43:59 perspective; what do you think is Mr. 44:02 Prabowo's main consideration for making 44:04 this change amid Indonesia's desire to 44:07 boost economic growth? First, of course 44:13 , uh my view is that Mr. Suyud, as Mr. 44:19 Jusuf Warsin mentioned earlier, is 44:23 included in the lineup of 30 names that 44:28 are on the Kompolnas radar, is uh a 44:35 group of, uh, the future leaders, uh, 44:40 yeah uh, his assignments, uh, like Mr. 44:46 Dahlan mentioned earlier about, uh, 44:50 Banten, right, a region that, sorry, uh 44:54 , Mas Yusuf and friends, is often known 44:58 for its strong, uh, "jawara" character. 45:04 But he was successful, uh, not just, uh 45:08 , lip service, uh, law enforcement 45:11 worked, but at the same time, uh, 45:17 Banten's character remained, uh, 45:20 respected. That's the saying, it's, uh, 45:23 being able to catch fish without 45:25 muddying the water. Now, that is not 45:27 easy, right. That is not easy. At the 45:31 BNN, he also, uh, uh, had achievements, 45:34 right. In fact, if I assess, uh, when 45:38 right now Indonesia is not just a hub, 45:41 right. So we could also be a main, uh, 45:46 uh, drug trafficking point, you know, 45:49 but we could also be a primary location 45:51 , right. And with his selection, since 45:56 he also has, uh, uh, a track record as 46:00 a field person, Mas Yusuf, right, not a 46:04 desk person, right. Uh, so that the 46:12 devil is in the details can be seen, 46:14 right. Now, of course, in the community 46:20 , uh, uh, police who are calming but 46:24 also don't create many, uh, issues, 46:30 moral issues, ethical issues, those are 46:33 tough challenges. And I am sure, uh, 46:39 his breakthroughs are also very 46:41 lightning-fast. Now, some say it's 46:44 brutal. Mas Yusuf, because, uh, by the 46:48 third day there were, uh, already many 46:51 new lineups. But for me, uh, everything 46:54 rises and falls on leadership. Yes, Mas 46:57 , uh, Suyudi has been given the trust 47:01 by Mr. Prabowo and I know the time 47:04 available is not much. On October 20th, 47:09 Mr. Prabowo will have reached 2 years 47:11 in leadership. Uh, surely there are 47:14 many agendas that need to be 47:16 accelerated. Including, I highly agree 47:18 with Mr. Dahlan. The main problem in 47:22 Indonesia is, uh, poverty, job 47:24 opportunities. One of the causes is 47:28 indeed investment, which, uh, long-term 47:32 , uh, manufacturing-based, uh, 47:34 investment, uh, that must be, uh, our 47:38 ease of doing business, we still always 47:42 have notes on our corruption perception 47:45 index, our bureaucratic reform, and all 47:49 of that is intertwined with, uh, legal 47:52 certainty, which is always a 47:55 prerequisite. Of course, there are 47:59 other prerequisites, uh, regarding our 48:01 incremental capital output ratio, which 48:02 is still 6 to 6 point something, which 48:04 makes us sometimes uncompetitive, but 48:06 we have advantages. We have a large 48:10 market, we have huge resources, our 48:13 middle class is large, demographic 48:15 bonus. Because of that, I really hope 48:20 Mas Suyudi, our new National Police 48:23 Chief, is firm, uh, his stance is 48:26 maintained, but he must truly get 48:28 things done. There can be no more empty 48:33 talk. Uh, because we really don't have 48:36 the luxury of time. The public, uh, 48:38 feels, uh, how low can you go? We are 48:42 not doing okay. That's it, Bang Karni. 48:48 >> All right, thank you Mr. Mardani for 48:50 your views. Now we go to Mr. Yusuf. Mr. 48:54 Yusuf, regarding police practices 48:57 abroad, such as in America where they 49:00 focus more on public service and are 49:03 under the states, rather than a 49:06 centralized federal system. There was 49:12 also discourse that in Indonesia, 49:13 perhaps the police should be placed 49:15 under local government or the Ministry 49:17 of Home Affairs. So, in the current 49:21 Indonesian context, how do you see the 49:23 most appropriate governance for the 49:25 National Police according to our needs, 49:27 the characteristics of our society, and 49:30 our country? You're still on mute, Mr. 49:37 Yusuf. 49:40 >> Yes. We have 49:42 >> a unitary state system. So, what is 49:46 built is a police system, our police 49:53 system, our national police system is a 49:57 centralized system. So, because it 50:04 follows our NKRI state system, the 50:07 unitary state. So, in the world, there 50:14 are generally three police systems. 50:18 There is a fragmented system. One 50:21 example is America. So, each state has 50:28 its own police, and each has its own 50:30 system. Right. Then there is the 50:35 federal police, like the FBI, right? 50:38 Then there is the integrated system. 50:43 This integrated system is above the 50:48 fragmented one, it's unified. However, 50:53 each part still retains its 50:56 characteristics. They are just 50:58 integrated. Then there is the 51:00 centralized system. Indonesia chose the 51:03 centralized system and it is indeed 51:04 appropriate because of the Unitary 51:06 State of the Republic of Indonesia. 51:09 When the '98 reform happened, which 51:13 previously had them under the Armed 51:16 Forces, the '98 reform constitution 51:20 amendments maintained the centralized 51:23 system. So, the National Police, or the 51:29 state police, is mentioned in the 51:32 constitution. And it is national in 51:37 nature with a hierarchical organization 51:41 , from the center down to the 51:44 sub-districts, regional commands, and 51:47 local stations. Therefore, the public 51:52 service policy is indeed centralistic. 51:56 So, the police in the regions are not, 51:59 what do you call it? Not a regional 52:03 organ, not a local organ, but a central 52:06 organ. So, the policy is centralized. 52:11 That is why the change of the National 52:14 Police Chief is very strategic because 52:17 it is the Chief who controls the 52:20 planning and policy determination, even 52:24 the technical policy directions. Yes, 52:27 Mr. Yusuf. 52:28 >> Yes. 52:29 >> Mr. Yusuf. 52:33 >> Well, I don't know how, Mr. Yusuf. One 52:37 of the things that ruins the reputation 52:39 of the police is that all levels of the 52:42 police are allowed to receive 52:44 complaints. So, people can file a 52:48 complaint at the sub-precinct, the 52:50 precinct, the regional office, or the 52:53 headquarters. In the end, those with 52:57 power, those who feel important, and 52:59 the wealthy tend to file their 53:01 complaints directly to the regional 53:03 office. or directly to the headquarters 53:07 . Could there be a fundamental change 53:12 where all complaints must only be filed 53:14 at the police station (Polsek), so that 53:17 the wealthy and those who feel powerful 53:20 cannot use their connections at higher 53:23 levels for their own interests? 53:28 Secondly, there are many civil cases 53:30 that are being criminalized. Civil 53:33 cases turned into criminal ones. Can 53:36 this be overcome with a system that I 53:38 call a jury system? So, when a police 53:42 station receives a complaint, if it is 53:44 clearly criminal, okay, handle it. If 53:47 it is clearly civil, okay, do not 53:49 handle it. But there are gray areas 53:51 between criminal and civil. For cases 53:55 like this, the police should not decide 53:58 immediately, but call, say, five 54:00 criminal and civil law professors to 54:02 act as a jury to determine if it is 54:05 civil or criminal. Now, if the jury's 54:09 conclusion is criminal, then the police 54:12 handle it. If the jury's conclusion is 54:14 civil, the police decline it. Like that 54:16 . Because this is the part that is 54:19 damaging the National Police. First, 54:21 wealthy people who report it directly 54:26 to the top. Second, civil cases being 54:29 criminalized are usually also by 54:31 wealthy people who are capable of 54:34 criminalizing civil matters. What do 54:36 you think, Mr. Yusuf? 54:39 >> Yes, regarding governance, for the law 54:43 enforcement service function, the 54:47 policy is centralized. Earlier, the 54:52 input from Mr. Dahlan was about how law 54:55 enforcement services should be at the 54:58 police station level. If we do that now 55:03 , based on the current competence and 55:06 capacity, it would be quite difficult. 55:10 Wait, like this, Sir. 55:14 >> The police stations are changed. 55:16 >> Police stations in important areas, if 55:19 necessary, the station chief could be a 55:21 colonel, that's fine, this is not a 55:23 military organization, this is a 55:25 service organization. 55:28 >> That's great. 55:32 >> Yes, if we do that now, I am a bit 55:34 doubtful about the human resource 55:37 capacity, even though the idea is good. 55:42 That would certainly require time; it 55:45 cannot be done in one year. It would 55:49 take five years to build the human 55:52 resource capacity to change the 55:54 governance of law enforcement services 55:57 to a police station-based model. 56:01 Meanwhile, some time ago there was a 56:03 policy, which is still in effect, where 56:06 some police stations do not even 56:08 conduct investigations. Inquiries, yes, 56:12 once it's a pro-justitia investigation, 56:15 they don't do it. Investigations are 56:17 carried out by the district police ( 56:19 Polres). Exactly. So, responding to 56:22 what Mr. Isk proposed, it will still 56:24 take a very long time. Five years is 56:27 the fastest to change the human 56:29 resource capacity of the National 56:31 Police. Second, regarding the 56:33 governance we currently have, there is 56:35 a new Criminal Procedure Code (KUHAP). 56:37 So, there is a new Criminal Procedure 56:39 Code. Actually, in the new Criminal 56:43 Procedure Code, to ensure cases that 56:45 are still vague and not criminal acts, 56:48 there is restorative justice. That is 56:51 our breakthrough in the new Criminal 56:53 Procedure Code through restorative 56:54 justice, actually. Exactly. That is 56:57 what has been built by the Criminal 57:00 Procedure Code. What we still need to 57:03 oversee is the change in technical 57:05 rules in the police regulation on 57:08 criminal investigation, which still has 57:11 many things that need to be adjusted. 57:14 So, that is the case for those vague 57:17 matters. Well, because we don't 57:21 recognize, um, what you call a jury 57:24 system in the recent Criminal Code, it 57:28 mentions a commissioner judge to ensure 57:31 that the investigation is correct and 57:35 in accordance with the mechanisms, 57:38 procedural law, and formalities, 57:42 including whether this is a criminal 57:46 element or not when it's elevated to an 57:50 investigation. We don't recognize a 57:53 jury system; in this testing effort, it 57:56 is referred to as a commissioner judge. 58:00 Well, there are many considerations, 58:01 one of which is the territory of 58:03 Indonesia, so we maintain the pretrial 58:05 testing system. In this case, once 58:09 again, the governance regarding whether 58:12 something is a crime or not is actually 58:16 handled by a case expose, which acts as 58:19 the jury instrument. In that case 58:24 expose, one of the inputs comes from 58:27 criminal law experts to determine 58:30 whether the investigation results 58:33 contain criminal elements or meet the 58:36 criteria. So, even if you want to adopt 58:41 the substance of a jury system, it 58:42 actually already exists through the 58:44 case expose. The purpose of the case 58:48 expose is to conclude whether the 58:50 investigation results can be elevated 58:53 to a formal criminal investigation. If 58:57 it is elevated to a formal 58:58 investigation, then it means there is a 59:00 criminal element. If not, it is stopped 59:02 . While the current governance is built 59:06 that way, even if it's called a jury 59:09 system, the case expose essentially 59:12 already acts as one, and it's not just 59:15 the police, but also the prosecutor's 59:18 office involved. However, it's about 59:23 professionalism, transparency, and 59:26 accountability—what was demanded in 59:28 the police reform recently; one of them 59:31 is the governance in law enforcement. 59:35 Mr. Dahlan, that is what I can answer. 59:39 Your idea is good, but making the local 59:41 police stations (Polsek) the base for 59:44 law enforcement services would likely 59:46 take at least 5 years, as one of the 59:48 things that must be done is improving 59:51 human resource capacity. Regarding the 59:56 coordination between the Criminal 59:58 Investigation Agency, regional police, 1:00:00 and local police, the rules of the game 1:00:03 already exist. Not all cases can be 1:00:06 reported to the regional police; there 1:00:08 are already indicators for that. It's 1:00:11 just that the issues of professionalism 1:00:14 and accountability are not, um, what 1:00:18 you call, held firmly enough. If it 1:00:22 doesn't fit the category for the 1:00:23 regional police, it actually shouldn't 1:00:26 be accepted. It must be transferred to 1:00:27 the local police station (Polres). 1:00:30 Therefore, if we monitor the data, many 1:00:32 police reports that do not fall under 1:00:35 the regional police category should 1:00:38 actually be referred to the local 1:00:40 police. That's it. 1:00:45 >> Alright, thank you Mr. Yusuf. I would 1:00:47 like to turn to Mr. Dahlan. Mr. Dahlan, 1:00:48 one of the issues anywhere, including 1:00:50 the National Police, is the problem of 1:00:52 human resource capacity, where we look 1:00:54 at the police education path. Now, look 1:00:56 here. Regarding capacity, we must think 1:00:58 progressively. Capacity doesn't mean 1:01:01 just educating the people at the local 1:01:03 police stations so they have capacity. 1:01:08 No. But the organization should be 1:01:10 changed so that among the police 1:01:12 sectors, there are city-level sectors, 1:01:15 for example. And the head of the police 1:01:19 sector could be a lieutenant colonel or 1:01:22 a senior commissioner. Now, this is a 1:01:25 matter of policy. In my opinion, it can 1:01:28 be finished in 2 years, it doesn't need 1:01:31 5 years, as long as there is a will to 1:01:33 fix all those issues. So, improving 1:01:37 human resources doesn't mean just 1:01:39 educating them. Indeed, the structure 1:01:43 must be changed so that smart people 1:01:45 have no issues being in the local 1:01:47 police sector. Just like now, if a 1:01:51 doctor wants to teach in kindergarten, 1:01:53 it’s not a problem, right? It's not 1:01:56 like before where a doctor had to teach 1:01:58 PhD students, right? In fact, it’s 1:02:00 even better if a doctor teaches 1:02:02 kindergarten or elementary school, it's 1:02:03 not a problem in education. Now, 1:02:05 that’s what I mean. 1:02:08 >> Yes, the point is indeed placing the 1:02:10 best people, right, Mr. Dahlan? In the 1:02:12 institutions. Yes, that's right. That 1:02:15 was it. So, Mr. Haldi. 1:02:17 >> Yes. 1:02:18 >> The intended change in human resource 1:02:20 capacity is not only at the educational 1:02:23 level, but there is also career 1:02:25 development that must be adjusted. 1:02:29 Because rank determines one's career at 1:02:33 which leadership level. For example, 1:02:37 currently, the leadership levels in the 1:02:40 National Police are determined by 1:02:42 education, like SESPIMA. SESPIMA is 1:02:45 education for future police sector 1:02:47 chiefs. Then there is SESPEN for future 1:02:50 police precinct chiefs, then there is 1:02:52 SESPIMTI. That, Mr. Yus, is what you 1:02:55 call police for the police, not yet 1:02:57 police for the people. Like that. 1:03:00 >> Now, this is what I mean. 1:03:01 >> It is police for the interests of the 1:03:03 police, yes. 1:03:04 >> Yes, that is what I meant earlier, the 1:03:06 improvement of HR capacity must be 1:03:08 followed by fixing the career system. 1:03:12 So that at the levels mentioned by Mr. 1:03:14 Dahlan earlier, the city-level police 1:03:17 sector can be led by a Superintendent. 1:03:21 Now, that must be in line with the 1:03:23 career path. Yes, the career path must 1:03:26 be built that way. That must be changed 1:03:29 first so that when he becomes a 1:03:31 Superintendent heading a city-level 1:03:34 sector, it is actually the same level 1:03:36 as being a regional police chief. Now, 1:03:39 that’s what is called. 1:03:39 >> Yes. That’s the point, and that 1:03:42 requires improvement that can’t take 1:03:44 a long time. Uh-huh. It shouldn't take 1:03:47 a short time. Now, that is what I mean. 1:03:51 Alright, thank you, Mr. Yusuf. Now, 1:03:54 let's go to Mr. Marani before the 1:03:55 closing statement. Closing, Mr. Marani, 1:03:58 what are the urgent police reform 1:04:00 agendas that need to be immediately 1:04:01 pursued by this new Police Chief? First 1:04:07 , if following the six recommendations 1:04:11 of the police reform acceleration team, 1:04:14 for me, it's institutional 1:04:17 transformation. A police force that is 1:04:23 friendlier, a police force with a more 1:04:27 service-oriented culture, and a police 1:04:31 force that is agile and has improved— 1:04:35 up until now, Mr. Yusuf, I appreciate 1:04:38 that there are many criminal cases that 1:04:42 can be handled quickly, but with AI, 1:04:46 cybercrime, including non-state actors, 1:04:51 attacks, and so on. Yesterday, banks in 1:04:56 Korea, even major banks, were all 1:05:01 suddenly hit by cyberattacks. So, 1:05:06 moving forward, we can prepare for the 1:05:08 idea that thieves are always smarter 1:05:10 than the police. Indeed, recruitment, 1:05:15 Mas Yusuf, recruitment, training, 1:05:18 mentoring, coaching—not just teaching 1:05:22 , but even consulting. That becomes an 1:05:26 integral part that keeps our police 1:05:28 force growing, developing, and able to 1:05:31 capture the future. If the character 1:05:35 has changed and service is evident, 1:05:37 while at the same time professionalism 1:05:40 and the ability to catch the future are 1:05:42 present, I am sure there won't be any 1:05:45 instability. As you mentioned earlier, 1:05:48 the satisfaction level was good at 1:05:50 70-80, but when a case arose, it 1:05:52 dropped again. Why is that? In my view, 1:05:56 the character of public perception is 1:06:00 not yet solid. Now, when the 1:06:04 institution transforms into being more 1:06:07 inclusive, serving everyone, open to 1:06:09 everyone, and, as I see it now, the 1:06:12 police in the community are very 1:06:14 down-to-earth. If that is followed by 1:06:18 the institutional change mentioned 1:06:19 earlier, becoming more service-oriented 1:06:21 and catching the future, God willing, 1:06:23 it will be so, Bang Hi. 1:06:27 >> Alright, thank you, Pak Mardani. 1:06:29 Friends, we have reached the end of 1:06:30 this talk show with the theme of the 1:06:32 National Police Chief succession. As 1:06:35 usual, before we conclude, we give the 1:06:37 speakers an opportunity for a closing 1:06:40 statement. The first closing statement, 1:06:42 Pak Mardani, please. You are invited, 1:06:44 Pak Mardani. Oh, he has left. Okay, 1:06:47 because he was on the road earlier. 1:06:48 Alright, Pak Yusuf, please give your 1:06:49 closing statement. 1:06:51 >> Yes. Let us build our optimism for our 1:06:55 new National Police Chief with the 1:06:58 tagline "Police with the Community," 1:07:01 which is the commitment of General 1:07:04 Listyo Sigit Prabowo's roadmap paradigm 1:07:07 . Therefore, we must guard, monitor, 1:07:12 and oversee this roadmap paradigm. And 1:07:17 lastly, whatever issues arise when 1:07:19 there are problems in public perception 1:07:22 or scrutiny regarding the police, the 1:07:24 substance is one: it is definitely 1:07:26 human resources. Therefore, we hope 1:07:31 regarding this human resources 1:07:34 substance, we hope and dream that 1:07:37 during the leadership of General Police 1:07:40 Listyo Sigit, we hope that cases of HR 1:07:44 violations and deviations are zero. 1:07:48 That is our hope. Therefore, 1:07:50 improvements in the HR sector are very 1:07:52 urgent because it is one of the six 1:07:54 recommendations from the Reform 1:07:56 Acceleration Commission that we support 1:07:59 and approve, which is related to the HR 1:08:01 sector. That is my closing statement, 1:08:05 Mas Heldi. Thank you for the invitation 1:08:07 . 1:08:08 >> Alright, thank you, Pak Yusuf. And next 1:08:11 , Pak Mardani has joined us again. 1:08:13 Closing statement, Pak Mardani, please. 1:08:15 >> Yes. My closing statement is the same 1:08:17 as Pak Mardani's. But indeed, regarding 1:08:23 what Pak... 1:08:24 >> What Pak Mardani said about being close 1:08:27 to the people, how will that be? He 1:08:30 already practiced that in Banten when 1:08:33 he was Regional Police Chief, having a 1:08:35 program called "Jumling." 1:08:38 >> Jumling is "Friday around"(visiting 1:08:39 different mosques). So, every Friday, 1:08:41 he did not perform Friday prayers at 1:08:43 just one mosque. moving from place to 1:08:46 place, and he also instructed all his 1:08:48 police chiefs to attend Friday prayers 1:08:51 at different mosques in their 1:08:52 surrounding areas. That way, they 1:08:56 become close to the people. But how 1:08:58 will it work on a national level? I am 1:09:00 looking forward to seeing what the 1:09:02 picture of being close to the community 1:09:04 , as Mr. Mardani mentioned earlier, 1:09:06 actually looks like. Thank you. Alright 1:09:09 , thank you Mr. Dahlan. Now, moving on 1:09:12 to Mr. Mardani. Perhaps you would like 1:09:14 to give a final closing statement in 1:09:16 response to Mr. Dahlan and Mr. Yusuf. 1:09:17 Please go ahead. 1:09:19 >> You are right, Mr. Dahlan. We have been 1:09:22 in the middle-income trap for too long. 1:09:27 Our education is stagnant, unemployment 1:09:31 among college graduates is high, and 1:09:35 our middle class is shrinking. This is 1:09:41 no easy matter. It is indeed not 1:09:44 entirely related to the police, but as 1:09:47 a solid and large institution that can 1:09:50 connect with society, the police can 1:09:53 not only provide a sense of security 1:09:56 and comfort but also help the 1:09:59 government achieve 8%economic growth. 1:10:04 God willing, that can happen, sir. 1:10:07 Alright, thank you Mr. Mardani, Mr. 1:10:09 Dahlan Iskan, and Mr. Yusuf Warsim. We 1:10:12 have high hopes and optimism for the 1:10:15 new National Police Chief, given his 1:10:18 high integrity, his closeness to the 1:10:20 people, and his courage in making 1:10:23 policies to uphold the law. Hopefully, 1:10:27 Indonesia's future will be bright with 1:10:29 him as the police chief. Law 1:10:31 enforcement will be clearer and 1:10:33 stronger in Indonesia, thus capable of 1:10:35 boosting economic growth and improving 1:10:37 the quality of the people's welfare. 1:10:40 Thank you, and see you on the next 1:10:42 Indonesia Topic at the same time and on 1:10:44 the same channel. Peace be upon you, 1:10:46 and Allah's mercy and blessings. 
